James Cameron Disses ROTF

[uraydo]

Really? What about the police sketch artists who can draw someone they have never even seen before, just going by an eye witness account?

They studied face structure for years, and when they do sit down with a witness, it is a continual process of trial and error, until the witness says, "that's the guy."

What about the artists who draw or paint the winners of a sporting game, on the spot?

Again, years of practice and learning anatomy. whether they are self taught, or they they have a teacher, makes little difference.

Or, what about me, I draw shit that comes out of my head, and it sure as hell didn't take "years" for me to grasp the concept. I've been doing this naturally ever since I was 4.

Judging from your pictures, you could use someone to show you some things.

There are even artists who have a photographic memory, and can draw right down to the tiniest pore, it's nothing to do with studying a reference point for years. Just see, and draw, or paint, or sculpt.

when you look at something to draw, you studie it. whether it be for a second or 5 hours.

In these pieces, I could tell you what works and what doesn't for a couple of points of view. I could even tell you how to make them better. But you would just spit out some bullshit about how art is subjective, and about how I don't know shit, and about how you are so much better than me cause you "don't have no need for no book learning (unknown comedian)," so why should I bother?

[warhorse]

Funny, the top was the blueprint I used to paint a mural for clients at the Palm Beach Polo and Equestrian club. They are professional art dealers, specialize in equestrian artwork from around the world, and paid me a pretty 5000 to have it done in their dining room. I average about 7 clients a year at about 3 to 5000 per mural, and I do this all for a part time gig. At various fund raising festivals, I've gotten great compliments from Richard T Stone, Thomas Kinkaid and Sam Savitte. So, your disses really don't mean anything.

But my love is into technology, so my full time is into space exploration equipment right now. Maybe I'll delve into the art profession when I retire, if I live that long.

Oh, about the sketch artists for the police department, that's not true about studying for years, one of my best friends is a sketch artist for the police department, and they hired her when she was only 15 and still in highschool. Pure raw talent on her part! I'm part of a group of artists who don't think much about art schools, if you already have the talent.

[Hanna]

That's like saying they weren't artist because they didn't have photoshop.

And you were complaining about people putting words in your mouth.

As for you statement which you seem to think I implied. I dont' believe I said anything of the sort. Actually I don't understand how you came up with photoshop.

I believe I was calling into question your implied thought that true masters are only masters if they study Anatomy, perspective, scale, composition, contrast, and line weight, etc. I was questioning you so you would put your thought in a better way than you had Nick.

The oringinal thing I was saying is there are very definable reasons why ROTF's story had failings, and I still stand by that. It's the same as looking at a picture and saying that the perspective is off, or that guy is a head shorter than he should be, or hell, that composition is not balanced.

And all I am saying is you are confusing story structure elements with story telling methods. The telling is like a recipe. For cinema the recipe is different from the comic book recipe. There are other things that come into play in cinema that you have not studied yet. And having not studied them you only see what you know at the moment. I will not argue there are problems with the story, but not to the extent you are arguing. Why? Because I understand that there other things that come into play that are hindering the untrained eye from see the full story. And it is those other things, like editing and timing, that are more of the problem than the story. Because they limited how much of the story you see and therefore can't make a definitive of what is really wrong with the story.

you claim yourself to be a really good artist, and I have no intention of questioning that.

You just did question that. And I wasn't the one who claimed to be. I believe it may have been warhorse that made that claim in another thread. I claim to be a professional artist. Whether one is a really good artist is subjective.

[Hanna]

The only absolutes in life is mathematics.

But even math has its variable and unknowns.

Here's a absolute for you, For those born, death is sure to follow.

[Inflataman]

Transformers will only be remembered for its great CGI from ILM. Shia Leboeuff and Megan Fox will be forgotten in 10 years....

So it's not like remember Jurassic Park for Sam Neill and Laura Dern. The fact is there are franchises that are remembered for there characters and/or story and there are franchises that are remembered for their effects. Transformers and Jurassic park fall into the later category.

[Xsubs]

Oh, about the sketch artists for the police department, that's not true about studying for years, one of my best friends is a sketch artist for the police department, and they hired her when she was only 15 and still in highschool. Pure raw talent on her part! I'm part of a group of artists who don't think much about art schools, if you already have the talent.

Its obvious your friend drew quite a bit as a little child.

I didnt have any prior Art Schools or anyone teaching me. It was all because I use to draw a lot when i was a child and from all that drawing,it has really paid off.

Theres no such thing as being born with a skill. Its all from learning, practicing and experience.

[uraydo]

Funny, the top was the blueprint I used to paint a mural for clients at the Palm Beach Polo and Equestrian club. They are professional art dealers, specialize in equestrian artwork from around the world, and paid me a pretty 5000 to have it done in their dining room. I average about 7 clients a year at about 3 to 5000 per mural, and I do this all for a part time gig. At various fund raising festivals, I've gotten great compliments from Richard T Stone, Thomas Kinkaid and Sam Savitte. So, your disses really don't mean anything.

But my love is into technology, so my full time is into space exploration equipment right now. Maybe I'll delve into the art profession when I retire, if I live that long.

Oh, about the sketch artists for the police department, that's not true about studying for years, one of my best friends is a sketch artist for the police department, and they hired her when she was only 15 and still in highschool. Pure raw talent on her part! I'm part of a group of artists who don't think much about art schools, if you already have the talent.

If you were the kind of person that listened, I was going to say I actually liked the top one. It's an excellent color studied and if it was done form the head, I would guess you spend a lot of time around these creatures. However, it is a little cartoony. you should either push that, or use more reference. Also, this is a horses head. this doesn't speak anything about what you know about composition, perspective, or contrast. well, maybe a little on contrast.

But we all know, you aren't the type of person that listens.

[uraydo]

And you were complaining about people putting words in your mouth.

As for you statement which you seem to think I implied. I dont' believe I said anything of the sort. Actually I don't understand how you came up with photoshop.

I believe I was calling into question your implied thought that true masters are only masters if they study Anatomy, perspective, scale, composition, contrast, and line weight, etc. I was questioning you so you would put your thought in a better way than you had Nick.





And all I am saying is you are confusing story structure elements with story telling methods. The telling is like a recipe. For cinema the recipe is different from the comic book recipe. There are other things that come into play in cinema that you have not studied yet. And having not studied them you only see what you know at the moment. I will not argue there are problems with the story, but not to the extent you are arguing. Why? Because I understand that there other things that come into play that are hindering the untrained eye from see the full story. And it is those other things, like editing and timing, that are more of the problem than the story. Because they limited how much of the story you see and therefore can't make a definitive of what is really wrong with the story.





You just did question that. And I wasn't the one who claimed to be. I believe it may have been warhorse that made that claim in another thread. I claim to be a professional artist. Whether one is a really good artist is subjective.

This conversation is making less and less since, so I'm going to stop now.

[The Great]

Funny, the top was the blueprint I used to paint a mural for clients at the Palm Beach Polo and Equestrian club. They are professional art dealers, specialize in equestrian artwork from around the world, and paid me a pretty 5000 to have it done in their dining room. I average about 7 clients a year at about 3 to 5000 per mural, and I do this all for a part time gig. At various fund raising festivals, I've gotten great compliments from Richard T Stone, Thomas Kinkaid and Sam Savitte. So, your disses really don't mean anything.

But my love is into technology, so my full time is into space exploration equipment right now. Maybe I'll delve into the art profession when I retire, if I live that long.

Oh, about the sketch artists for the police department, that's not true about studying for years, one of my best friends is a sketch artist for the police department, and they hired her when she was only 15 and still in highschool. Pure raw talent on her part! I'm part of a group of artists who don't think much about art schools, if you already have the talent.

You look at art schools the wrong way. The skills that are being taught to you are skills that can only enhance your art. I used to think the same way until i decided to give it a try and listen. What really convinced me was when i started paying attention to muscular and bone structure. When you are looking at a persons face and can or body and see how their muscle structure interacts with lighting to give them there "look" it really improves how accurate you are when recreating a living creature.

I look back and see my former point of view a bit ignorant. I thought to myself how can i call myself an artist when i don't learn everything i can to better myself. you should soak up and implement all you learn no matter the source

[The Great]

If you were the kind of person that listened, I was going to say I actually liked the top one. It's an excellent color studied and if it was done form the head, I would guess you spend a lot of time around these creatures. However, it is a little cartoony. you should either push that, or use more reference. Also, this is a horses head. this doesn't speak anything about what you know about composition, perspective, or contrast. well, maybe a little on contrast.

But we all know, you aren't the type of person that listens.

Ury lol if you could have refrained from talking down to him you might have made your point. lmao i will never tire of reading your post lmao

[AutobotHulk]

I like to do a little art work myself this is somthing I did while I was bored at work

[Xsubs]

some of my drawings:
wallpaper.jpg

[AutobotHulk]

Nice, those are great.

[AutobotHulk]

I just bought the Wacom Bamboo I haven't had a chance to test it out but I wanted to try getting the hang of it first before getting a Wacom Cintiq 12W its a pricey at $999 but I'm trying to go as far as I can, there is the Cintiq 21UXfor $2000 but that is crazy, its nice but too pricey.

[uraydo]

I just bought the Wacom Bamboo I haven't had a chance to test it out but I wanted to try getting the hang of it first before getting a Wacom Cintiq 12W its a pricey at $999 but I'm trying to go as far as I can, there is the Cintiq 21UXfor $2000 but that is crazy, its nice but too pricey.

As soon as I can afford it, I'm totally getting a Cintiq. they had them at my school, and they make coloring so much fun.

[uraydo]

Ury lol if you could have refrained from talking down to him you might have made your point. lmao i will never tire of reading your post lmao

yeah, I was getting ready for work when I wrote that, so I was a little over agitated. Plus, I just spent 130 dollars on having pink eye. you know the day is going to be great when you literally have to use your finger nail to open one of your eyes.

[wingzero]

Just saw the 1080p Quicktime Teaser Trailer of Avatar and the CGI looks bad.. just barely average, not photorealistic at all, it seems that the movie is going to be the most expensive 3D cartoon ever made.
James Cameron and WETA and FOX are now telling on forums than in 3D it looks a lot better and so on.. that is still marketing hype going on, they must be really worried that if people won't buy the hype the movie could bomb like no other Cameron movie did before.
Actually Avatar looks like an average movie with average CGI and nothing else. It's such a huge disappointment.
Transformers2 and District9 feature the most advanced CGI ever seen to date. Not Avatar as the FOX marketing machine keep claiming. Watching it 3D won't change anything, the CGI can't get any better if in 2D already looks so bad. The rendering is so fake, even worse than many console games.
James Cameron should be ashamed of himself instead of criticizing Michael Bay and ILM CGI on Transformers2. At least despite the storyline cuts and shortened scenes causing issues to the movie flow and characters development the CGI on Transformers2 is really the best ever seen to date. That on Avatar it's just barely average instead.
It's weird that WETA managed to do an amazing work on District9 for Sony but is releasing such a low quality CGI on the most anticipated and hyped James Cameron movie ever.

[BeetleJuice]

Just saw the 1080p Quicktime Teaser Trailer of Avatar and the CGI looks bad.. just barely average, not photorealistic at all, it seems that the movie is going to be the most expensive 3D cartoon ever made.
James Cameron and WETA and FOX are now telling on forums than in 3D it looks a lot better and so on.. that is still marketing hype going on, they must be really worried that if people won't buy the hype the movie could bomb like no other Cameron movie did before.
Actually Avatar looks like an average movie with average CGI and nothing else. It's such a huge disappointment.
Transformers2 and District9 feature the most advanced CGI ever seen to date. Not Avatar as the FOX marketing machine keep claiming. Watching it 3D won't change anything, the CGI can't get any better if in 2D already looks so bad. The rendering is so fake, even worse than many console games.
James Cameron should be ashamed of himself instead of criticizing Michael Bay and ILM CGI on Transformers2. At least despite the storyline cuts and shortened scenes causing issues to the movie flow and characters development the CGI on Transformers2 is really the best ever seen to date. That on Avatar it's just barely average instead.
It's weird that WETA managed to do an amazing work on District9 for Sony but is releasing such a low quality CGI on the most anticipated and hyped James Cameron movie ever.

This.

Avatar has massive fail written all over it. More than the weak CGI, I don't believe folks really want to see a movie about talking blue cats. Me thinks the whole story will suck, unfortunately.

[AutobotHulk]

As soon as I can afford it, I'm totally getting a Cintiq. they had them at my school, and they make coloring so much fun.

Yeah my friend from work got one and I was really digging it, she has the Cintiq 21UX, I like it because of its mobility since I like to travel.

[uraydo]

This.

Avatar has massive fail written all over it. More than the weak CGI, I don't believe folks really want to see a movie about talking blue cats. Me thinks the whole story will suck, unfortunately.

Dude, there is a whole sub culture that wants to see talking blue cats... and more than a few of those, want to see them having sex.


To tell you the truth, this film seems a lot like the Final Fantasy movie, which I think should have done better than it did. However, I cant stand behind a movie, where a human gets turned into an alien and manages to connect with them on a level no other human has done before, right after watching District 9.


I'm not really sure how I feel about this movie, but most likely the 3D aspect won't sell me one way or the other.

[r-type]

Dude, there is a whole sub culture that wants to see talking blue cats... and more than a few of those, want to see them having sex.

Freudian Slip, ftw!

[StefsChemicalRomance]

In all fairness, Titanic was mainly a huge love story with a bit of action splashed in - and look how far it got.

[Xsubs]

Just saw the 1080p Quicktime Teaser Trailer of Avatar and the CGI looks bad.. just barely average, not photorealistic at all, it seems that the movie is going to be the most expensive 3D cartoon ever made.
James Cameron and WETA and FOX are now telling on forums than in 3D it looks a lot better and so on.. that is still marketing hype going on, they must be really worried that if people won't buy the hype the movie could bomb like no other Cameron movie did before.
Actually Avatar looks like an average movie with average CGI and nothing else. It's such a huge disappointment.
Transformers2 and District9 feature the most advanced CGI ever seen to date. Not Avatar as the FOX marketing machine keep claiming. Watching it 3D won't change anything, the CGI can't get any better if in 2D already looks so bad. The rendering is so fake, even worse than many console games.
James Cameron should be ashamed of himself instead of criticizing Michael Bay and ILM CGI on Transformers2. At least despite the storyline cuts and shortened scenes causing issues to the movie flow and characters development the CGI on Transformers2 is really the best ever seen to date. That on Avatar it's just barely average instead.
It's weird that WETA managed to do an amazing work on District9 for Sony but is releasing such a low quality CGI on the most anticipated and hyped James Cameron movie ever.

The FeedBack from the 15 minute Preview screenings really put the hype from the audience even more.

The Trailer doesnt do it justice.

They're still working on the GCI until The end of November. besides, skin tone is much harder to do than metal renderings.

[halofan1]

And by the way Jim, I can say the same thing about your Terminator films - do you actually think that people remember T1 or T2 because of the great story?

Considering about 60% of action/horror films past 1984 involved a person being protected from a supernatural being, I'd say the plot is pretty fucking important. Really, take a look at how many films "borrowed" THE TERMINATOR's plot since it was released.

[Bayhem]

Considering about 60% of action/horror films past 1984 involved a person being protected from a supernatural being, I'd say the plot is pretty fucking important. Really, take a look at how many films "borrowed" THE TERMINATOR's plot since it was released.

That's not the answer, because my question was, "Do you actually think that people remember T1 or T2 because of the great story?". Tell me what you think and be honest...why do you think people remember the Terminator films, especially T2?

Because of the story or because of the action and the visual effects?


Or better yet, what comes to people's minds when they hear the word "Terminator" - a great story or a great action and great effects?

And don't get me wrong, I've always liked the Terminator films, I'm just trying to be objective here.