Official RoTF discussion thread **PART 2 /Reviews go here** [ SPOILERS ]

[Optimash Prime]

so why do we call him Grindor? Because the toy says so?

Does he look the same as Blackout? Then he's Blackout.

Because only fanboys know he is Grindor.

The general population (which also makes up more than 80% of the theater), the general non G1 movie going public knows him as the helicopter from the first movie, knows him as Blackout

Id totally go with you on this one darth...but then theres the bone crusher look alike in the desert scene so apparently there can be similar Dcons

[MovinForward]

IT'S NOT A GAG!

I tried to explain this in my earlier post, using the hypothetical example of humping dogs. [CLICK HERE FOR THAT POST.]

Alas no-one replied, and I fear it has gone soaring over the heads of everyone who read it. Maybe everyone was too entertained and distracted by the old farting robot with a walking stick.

THAT IS YOUR OPINION.
The upper-case and bolding was greatly unneeded.

I didn't reply to that because I directly stated that I was no longer taking action in that argument-to-be because I felt at the rate it was going it would turn into a full-blown, hate-filled argument. I say that because everything you say has the undertone of 'If you liked the movie/humor/characters then you have an IQ of a 6 year old'. Such as the sentence bolded above. You go about calling the movie/humor juvinile yet here you are insulting our intelligence because no-one replyed to you're comment. Guess what? Big deal! Your comment is no-more important than anyone elses. Same with mine. If no-one felt the need or want to reply, so be it. I replyed because I feel directly insaulted by your comment. I don't know if you're trying to be rude but that's the feeling get from all of your post.
I'm not telling you to not voice your opinion, I'm asking you to 'watch your tone' per-say. It could just be me and if so, I'm sorry but I'm tired of dealing with your better-then-thou complex.

Now, I'm going to go sit off in a corner to cool off so I don't jump anyone.

[nimrod323]

so why do we call him Grindor? Because the toy says so?

Does he look the same as Blackout? Then he's Blackout.

Because only fanboys know he is Grindor.

The general population (which also makes up more than 80% of the theater), the general non G1 movie going public knows him as the helicopter from the first movie, knows him as Blackout

you dont have to follow the series,novels or comics to know the difference man, Blackout alt mode is a MH 53 chopper,

(its black)

Grindor is also a MH 53 chopper,its the tan version

[TheBigBad]

Mr. Bay,

Over the weekend I went and saw Tranformers: Revenge of the Fallen. Based on what I had read overwhelmingly in the press, I thought I was going to bear witness to the biggest piece of crap ever committed to film. What I saw… was not. However the film did have a great many problems. You’re the director, you have a vision, I get that... The last thing you want is some anonymous fanboy second guessing every choice you made, and quite frankly you probably could care less about my opinion. But consider this, I and thousand of others like me went out and bought tickets to your movie, and catapulted it to the top of the box office. Half of us were thoroughly entertained, and can’t understand the critics take on this film. The other half, which includes me, were entertained, but felt the movie went off the rails in more than a few areas. We, empathize with the critics, but do not spit the venom they do. Dogs humping? Whacked out kitchen appliances with a “penis” gun? Robots cussing? Robot balls? Perhaps the craziest concept of all… Weed being sold out in the open and conveniently labeled as such for easier identification by the police?


The Autobots are supposed to be an ancient and noble race, not crass street thugs. Instead of these primitive attempts at humor, how about respecting and growing the franchise? Replace a scene of pointless dog humping with a scene of Megatron and Starscream interacting, fleshing out their characters. Because when those two were together, it was note perfect, and their interactions had me grinning ear to ear. But then something crass would happen and take away from any goodwill you had built up to that point. You see these characters as pointless toys for you to exploit in whatever way you see fit. In many ways you get a lot right, but in other ways you completely miss the boat. What troubles me, is you don’t seem to care.


You have been given one of the greatest franchises in movie history. These films should be the "Star Wars” for a new generation. Episodes I, II, and III were supposed to do that, but really didn’t live up to anyone’s expectations, too flat, badly directed, etc. But Transformers had every potential of becoming the sweeping epic those films were not. A rich back story full of everything needed to create an amazing world that would leave audiences breathless. But in the name of “fun” the history of these characters has been cheapened with fart jokes, and robots humping legs. Did Han Solo ever fart to get a laugh?


Which brings me to my point. The reason your movie did so well is not because it was a particularly great film. It’s because you’re the only person in the giant transforming robot business right now, and Transformers fans like giant transforming robots, so we go in droves to see what you have made using a franchise we all hold very near and dear to our hearts. We watch, sometimes we cheer, and other times we feel like we have been betrayed as the characters we hold in such high esteem are brought down to such a baseless and crude level. Basically you are what Joel Schumacher was to the Batman films. His only point of reference was the 60’s Batman TV show; he ignored every other piece of source material because he had a vision. The result, we got a Batman with plastic nipples. You too seem to be blinded by a similar vision… The result, Devastator has testicles. Seriously? I think I speak for a great many Transformers fans in saying we want you to be less like Joel Schumacher and more like Christopher Nolan. We still are looking for the truly great, truly perfect Transformers film.


We have paid the ticket prices, we have watched faithfully, we have endured your vision and paid you a great deal of respect. So for the next one, if you’re still attached, how about you respect us, the fans? Listen to your screenwriters, heck bring on dire hard fans as consultants, do focus groups to see what we might like to see in a film. Because if you think you’ve made a lot of money now with a film the critics think is “bad.” Just imagine how much money you’ll make if you create a Transformers film on the same level as “The Dark Knight?” You have haters, for sure, but I’m not one of them, I and I’m sure many others simply want a better class of product from someone who is capable of so much more.


P.S. Please vocoder Soundwave’s voice on the DVD release, otherwise I won’t buy it.

Peace

[Trailbreaker]

P.S. Please vocoder Soundwave’s voice on the DVD release, otherwise I won’t buy it.

So after all of the many problems you point out about this movie, you pick one of the most trivial reasons to not buy the DVD.

[Mindfreak87]

lol I thought this was a joke, all I saw was a smiley face in the center of the screen (white forum skin).

[Sonya]

Oh! Here's something I haven't mentioned yet!

I never thought I'd say this, but ARCEE WAS COOL! I was genuinely sorry that she got taken out because she was quite visually interesting and I was against her being in the movie from the START! Yet, turns out, I like what they did there. I hope she gets repaired for the third movie and gets to get her combiner freak on.

Question: I saw two of the sisters get taken out (not sure if they're dead or just down), but the third was hunched against a stone wall or something. I never saw her get killed(or missed it totally). Anyone else notice anything?

The Primes were created directly by Primus. They are like semigods.. they are an appendix of Primus. That is the reason why they had the power to resurrect Sam from death.
The Transformers original mythology has many things similar to Lord Of The Rings books, which shows that sci-fi writers at the time probably were fans of those books which inspired them. Primus and Unicron are powerful semigods, one good and the other absolute evil. The fact that Transformers are made of metal doesn't mean that they are objects, they are sentient beings with a soul.

I thought there was some mystic stuff going on, but I also love epic fantasy so I thought I might have been misreading the whole thing.


But I loved how the primes brought Sam back.

[Andreas]

Sigh...

Why do people have to be so serious about a robot movie? IT'S A MOVIE ABOUT ROBOTS FROM OUTER SPACE FIGHTING EACH OTHER!

Why can't you enjoy it for what it is?

[nelson]

The next asshole who makes a false racism charge gets his ass banned.

You people are so fucking delusional you make serious allegations without considering the consequences.

[Drake]

With the racism accusations... if you want to point out the bad, maybe you should be fair and point out the good. You know... the smallest and weakest of the autobots bravely confronting the monstrous Devastator. Negative stereotype? I'd LOVE to have those guys on my side.

[MovinForward]

With the racism accusations... if you want to point out the bad, maybe you should be fair and point out the good. You know... the smallest and weakest of the autobots bravely confronting the monstrous Devastator. Negative stereotype? I'd LOVE to have those guys on my side.

Very well said! I'm gonna remember that next time someone make a racist comment!

[wingzero]

Sigh...

Why do people have to be so serious about a robot movie? IT'S A MOVIE ABOUT ROBOTS FROM OUTER SPACE FIGHTING EACH OTHER!

Why can't you enjoy it for what it is?

I keep reading people like you telling that the movie would be a farce, not serious and so on for some jokes, a little flaws and such.... So my question is.. does that apply to other movies that have some nonsense silly jokes in them like even Lord Of The Rings, for example? Is that not a serious movie?

Transformers2 has some flaws compared to the first and compared to its own novel but telling that it's not dark and not serious it's just not true. What I would have liked to see was those flaws fixed and it would have been perfect but despite them the movie is still way serious. Yes, Bay should have added more deaths. Like soldier bodies being crushed by Decepticons in the desert during the fight and being killed, the opening with the Fallen killing humans points to a darker movie. And the first movie had the opening scene of Blackout attack and the whole Scorponok attacks in the desert giving a better feeling of threat to militaries. This second movie lacks many inter-link/refinement scenes and little darker details that could have allowed it to be perfect.
I would have liked to see Megatron or Starscream trying to torture Mikaela when Sam is captured by them and before Optimus and Bumblebee arrived to save them. That would have helped viewers to get a way darker vision and feel the threat/near-death experience. If such a scene exists and the CGI was or could be finalized then I really hope that it will get re-integrated in the Blu-Ray version with an Extended cut.

[TIMtationX]

So after all of the many problems you point out about this movie, you pick one of the most trivial reasons to not buy the DVD.

Yea, So instead of the DVD selling 1,000,000 copies, it'll sell 999,999..

[Ultra Magnus]

Sigh...

Why do people have to be so serious about a robot movie? IT'S A MOVIE ABOUT ROBOTS FROM OUTER SPACE FIGHTING EACH OTHER!

Why can't you enjoy it for what it is?

This.

Remember also that the movie is based on a toy line - there are probably people who will never take this movie franchise seriously as a result, no matter how much sophistication and multilayering you put into its story. Having said that, I think it would be best to just acknowledge that fact and have some fun, which is what I as an audience member am doing. This isn't Shakespeare, yet some people seem to expect that level of depth and sophistication.

Besides, it's not as if the G1 cartoon - which, I imagine, a lot of fans are using as a reference point to compare the movie franchise - had sophisticated plot lines or was especially thought-provoking. (I happen to like G1, by the way.)

[A49ER08]

well just saw TF2 for the 2nd time, this time in IMAX DOME
and I have to say I'm glad I saw it the first time in Imax DIgital

it was very hard to discern what was going on, you were constantly moving your head just so you can get in all the action

I was thinking that it would be far superior than Imax Digital, I was wrong... maybe it was my seats? I was sitting in the center

the bumblee/rampage fight was almost impossible to tell what was going on

Devastator looked great !

[Blurr]

It was so awesome!! XD the theater was completely packed (thankfully we got good seats) and every1 there were laughing a lot and I guess we were laughing to loud cause the usher came in and said we were disturbing people :wtf anyway I have to save up more money cause I am definitely watching it again! And anyone who says it stunk is gonna say hello to a butt whooping! ;p

[Ironhide1977]

Well I Was disappointed about the movie. The Autobots had just a walk on. Many plotholes. Stupid Humor. Instead of the Autobots, the US Army were the heroes of course. Most of the Bots talked just a few words and what about Jolt? And what baout the Twins after fighting Devastator?

[dw2121]

Heres my neutral view on Revenge of the Fallen

Before i begin im neither a lover or a hater of Michael Bays films and consider myself a mature movie goer that likes a variety of films some big some small, Heat, Star Wars OT, Gattaca to name a few

Now iam orginally a 1984 G1 Transformers fan , and the 1st Transformers film i thought was mission accomplished. It flowed well, the story was there without being complexed, it had its flaws but overall - good enjoyable flick.

The opening sequence of ROTF wet my appitite and i was begining to get excited for what lay ahead, but things just seem to fall apart. The relationship between Sam and Makala , i thought i was watching Dawson Creek !! The story starts to speed up as if its running out of time to show of its CGI muscle,

I have no idea who some of the characters are , saying that i actually thought skids and mudflaps were funny in this, however Jetfre, i always imagined him being like the Cartoon the Autobot answer to Star Scream, there seems to be a lack of development with the characters.



Overall the movie felt like the CGI was made 1st and the story added later, it was spectacular effects but its like watching an MTV video without the music , there confusion and holes within the story.

Id give it 6 out of 10

[wingzero]

The opening sequence of ROTF wet my appitite and i was begining to get excited for what lay ahead, but things just seem to fall apart. The relationship between Sam and Makala , i thought i was watching Dawson Creek !! The story starts to speed up as if its running out of time to show of its CGI muscle,

The story doesn't speed up. It actually slows down too much at various points while the first movie really never slowed down. That is one of the flaws it has.
You never watched Dawson Creek soap thing then (there is nothing like soap in Transformers2) because there is less Sam and Mikaela than expected, they should have put more romance and increase the tragic effect of Sam death, which looks tragic but not enough. I mean.. in that scene it would have been better to have militaries taking Sam dead body into a safer place out of the battle zone.. have Mikaela and his family follow him... Then militaries telling that Sam was definitely dead... and at that point having like Mikaela dropping the matrix dust from her hand on a table where Sam was ... and the dust activating and the Primes contacting Sam while Mikaela and his parents were crying... that would have worked a lot better than the shortened way in the movie. It would have given a stronger feeling of sadness and tragedy.
The fact that many scenes look shortened than what Bay could have achieved just shows that flaws have been caused by production issues. If it wasn't for all the issues they got during production stages (the writers strike, Shia injuries) and for Paramount pressure to release the movie with no delays and mantain a short runtime ... we would have got the best ever sci-fi action movie to date and the best Transformers movie. Unfortunately due to this kind of flaws the movie is not perfect and not as much refined as the first movie was. It's an excellent movie and CGI and action scenes wise absolutely better than the first but all flaws could have been eliminated if only Mr.Bay had more time to work on the movie I think.
I still hope that a Director's Cut/Extended version will be released on Blu-Ray adding all the finalized deleted scenes and maybe completing the CGI in all deleted scenes that couldn't be completed for the theatrical release. I would love to see a way longer cut able to at least fix in part the existing flaws because I bet that many filmed scenes able to achieve the fixing could exist.

[InvestiGator169]

well just saw TF2 for the 2nd time, this time in IMAX DOME
and I have to say I'm glad I saw it the first time in Imax DIgital

it was very hard to discern what was going on, you were constantly moving your head just so you can get in all the action

I was thinking that it would be far superior than Imax Digital, I was wrong... maybe it was my seats? I was sitting in the center

the bumblee/rampage fight was almost impossible to tell what was going on

Devastator looked great !

I learned from the 1st movie that if you are going to see it in an IMAX dome, you have to sit right above the projection box near the top row in the center. Those were the best seats. You didn't have to do much searching at all to follow the film. At least that's how it was designed here in Tampa.

[carlpickard]

You people are so fucking delusional you make serious allegations without considering the consequences.

:wtf

What are "the consequences" of discussing this issue on an internet forum...?

[soundwaveblaster]

Awesomely put ! I will hold out hope for Part 3 !!!!

[Devastator]

I seen it yesterday, but not in imax. I would have given it a 5 on imdb and not a 6. I can knick pick this movie to death about things I didn't like but I won't. I won't even say what I enjoyed. I will say that this is not the kind of movie I would see over and over again.

I was not disappointed at all but I didn't expect this. A movie like this is not for my mentality. I hate using that word I am not that kind of person to think he is better. I felt the movie was for children ages 12 and younger, and if Bay was going for that demographic he hit it with a sledgehammer. The theater was full of them so I witnessed first hand. Even the parents of these children cringed and sighed so at least I felt I wasn't alone on this.

All I can say in reviewing this movie at my age is that I think it's Bay's worst. I will not be buying the dvd or bd. I have no children and do not want to spend my time or money on it again. Sorry, Bay but it's not for me. As for the other releases on bd I hope they come soon.

[nelson]

:wtf

What are "the consequences" of discussing this issue on an internet forum...?

Because you people are making shit up and making false accusations.

[carlpickard]

Because you people are making shit up and making false accusations.

...What is anyone "making up"?

And I'm afraid I'm still no clearer - what are the "consequences" you speak of?