Official RoTF discussion thread **PART 2 /Reviews go here** [ SPOILERS ]

[jamjam101]

can anyone tell me, how come that 'The Fallen' says in the movie 'only a prime can defeat me' means that only a Prime can kill a Prime...how come Megatron was able to kill Optimus? Am I missing out on something from the cartoons?

[taybrian1]

can anyone tell me, how come that 'The Fallen' says in the movie 'only a prime can defeat me' means that only a Prime can kill a Prime...how come Megatron was able to kill Optimus? Am I missing out on something from the cartoons?

The Fallen is different because he is one of the originals. Optimus is just a desendant. He might be the only one that can defeat The Fallen, but that ability must have thinned out when it came to Optimus. It hope that makes a bit of sense.

[jamjam101]

The Fallen is different because he is one of the originals. Optimus is just a desendant. He might be the only one that can defeat The Fallen, but that ability must have thinned out when it came to Optimus. It hope that makes a bit of sense.

yea that makes sense...soo Optimus isnt directly a Prime..but passed through many generations i guess?

is that also why, that in the first movie, when all the TF's come from space, and scan cars, when Optimus scans the truck that drives by, he didnt look like a Prime like in TF2.

taybrian1...did u like the film? i personally loved it. i saw it twice in Imax. but i still cant decide if it's beter than the first. definately more emotional and funny.

[5 Star General]

Saw it in IMAX yesterday--Rochester, NY..7pm--it was sold out--lucky i bought my tickets 3 weeks ago--the 10pm show was also sold out...I have to say the movie was the SHIT---I saw nothing wrong with the wrecking balls..the humping and there wasn't that much jokes everyone was talking about---the twins were great--no racism like the the press said...Everyone laugh at all the funny parts--as for the multiple bots---nooooo--that big green guy was the one that rose meg--the other green one that formed devastator was already in egypt at the crater/construcution site--Even if they were multiple bots---i think they appeared after the rail gun split them apart..i dont think that the rail gun destroyed then cause they all have seperated sparks (IMO)--however i jus could follow the transformation and fight---my eyes couldnt adjust ---optimus was on steroids--Ill see i again next week on normal screen...THE MOVIE WAS TOOOOOOOO SHORT...

ok u can merge this post now

[MrX]

Saw the Movie on Friday at the local Empire Theater. And I have to completely agree with you. It was an awesome experience. Looking forward to seeing transformers3. Whenever that happens.

[AlcatrazHero07]

AHHH! IT WAS AWESOME!!! I'm convinced that the only reason the first movie was made was so that he could make this one! And Armageddon, Pearl Harbor, and the Bad Boys were made so that he - and only he - could pull it off!!

Best theater experience of my life!!!

I only saw it only once so far, in IMAX, because I saw the first one in theaters, followed by an IMAX viewing, and it was like watching two different movies!!! 10 times better experience! (9 times the resolution)

While waiting in line yesterday at IMAX with my friend who had already seen it in theaters, I told him: "You've seen a movie entitled 'Transformers 2: Revenge of the Fallen', but you've never seen THIS!!!"

I have to watch it again before I declare it "the best movie I've ever seen in my life", but it had it all: more action than any other movie - by far, humor and quotables, characters you can root for, mesmerizing visuals, lots of twists, destruction on scales never seen before, and enough food for a lifetime of dreaming!!!

Thank you Michael Bay. Thank you so very much!!!!!!!!!

[nelson]

ok u can merge this post now

I shouldn't have to do this if you only had followed the rules I so politely just gave out.

Please don't do it again.

[DECEPTICON-BITCH]

This movie was a MAJOR disappointment for me I really really didn't like it. Its actually up there with some of my all time least fav. movies.......

......poor Ravage. Devastator, Blackout.....

...man. REALLY.

So disappointing. I could literally tear up over it.

This was supposed to be...

...

[nelson]

This movie was a MAJOR disappointment for me I really really didn't like it. Its actually up there with some of my all time least fav. movies.......

......poor Ravage. Devastator, Blackout.....

...man. REALLY.

So disappointing. I could literally tear up over it.

This was supposed to be...

...

In the words of Celene Dion: "Your heart will go on..."

It's just a movie.

[Sonya]

I think the biggest WTF moment was when the helicoper just dropped Optimus Primes body like a sack of potatoes on the tarmac. I thought they had lost their minds in treating him like that.

I flinched when I saw that. But it was good because it just reinforced that not all the humans really think of the autobots as 'real' thinking/feeling beings. It hurt to watch, but served a purpose by pissing off lennox and epps and the other soldiers that worked with the autobots too. (maybe if optimus hadn't been disrespected like that, they wouldn't have been as willing to risk doing what Sam needed them to do.)

Ah, that was probably me. I still don't think that holds up to the first. Am I one of the few who didn't cry for Sam? Lol, and to think, after the first movie everyone was hating on Sam and other humans! But really, nothin strikes me as 'beautiful' in the same way TF1 did.

I do still love those scenes in TF1 the most, but I also liked the ones in TF2. But the arrival of the autobots TF1(and the score was just beautiful) will always be one of my favorite moments.




I just finished watching ROTF a second time and was surprised I liked it much better on the second viewing. After I saw it the first time, i was like.......oh, it's okay, pretty good....but........

Then I saw it a second time and it was just awesome. maybe I was too tired the first time or there was just so much to take in.....not sure.


But seeing it a second time.......I LOVED IT......SUPER AWESOME MOVIE.

[carlpickard]

Am I missing out on something from the cartoons?

You really need not worry about that at all - Bay paid very little heed to the source material, as he has explained in numerous interviews ("I couldn't sit through 10 minutes of the animated movie" etc). There are indications in both movies that "canon" is not really at the forefront of his mind - such as the tank in the first movie being called "Devastator" with no forethought for what was to come.

For what it's worth - OF COURSE Optimus was a Prime. The clue is in his title - "Optimus PRIME". Jetfire says in disbelief "...a living Prime..." when he's resurrected. As for the "only a Prime can kill a Prime" thing, and Megatron? F*ck knows.

Such a mess.

[Wisconsimus Prime]

Hello Everyone,
This is my first post after following the site for over a year. I just wanted to add my opinion of the movie to the mix. I have seen the film twice, once on opening night (12:01am) in IMAX in NYC and again in a normal theater at an 11am show. Both crowds were amazing. Applause at the end of each showing. And in both screenings there was a huge ovation when Optimus is brought back to life and joins with Jetfire (not bad for 11am). Overall I have to say I REALLY enjoyed this film and honestly I liked it more the second time when I could forget about the hype and just take it in. I will admit that there are some shortcomings when it comes to plot, character development etc, but after all it's a TRANSFORMERS MOVIE!!!! Stuff blows up, it's cool. All the haters need to just be quiet and go see "My Sisters Keeper". Just turn your brain off, sit back and enjoy. Great job to Mr. Bay and his team. I'm looking forward to a 3rd installment. To all the site administators, great job. I've enjoyed the ongoing commintary and look forward to more.

Thanks for your time.

"Kill him Bee" followed by Bumblebee ripping Ravage's spine out and beating Rampage with it. Come on....How cool was that!!!

[Sonya]

For what it's worth - OF COURSE Optimus was a Prime. The clue is in his title - "Optimus PRIME". Jetfire says in disbelief "...a living Prime..." when he's resurrected. As for the "only a Prime can kill a Prime" thing, and Megatron? F*ck knows.

Such a mess.

So, maybe that wasn't as well thought out as it could have been, but it wasn't a movie wrecker for me.

[UnclePetey]

To: All you fanboy types

From: Most of the rest of us

Please stop crying and just enjoy the damned movie for what is was filmed to be- an over-the-top cavalcade of explosions and baddassery, with the occasional human bits and (funny) potty humor! Wh cares that char x was killed in Episode whatever of some damned cartoon/comic? NO ONE BUT YOU!!! Just sit back and enjoy the epicness of giant effing robots!!!!

[taybrian1]

yea that makes sense...soo Optimus isnt directly a Prime..but passed through many generations i guess?

is that also why, that in the first movie, when all the TF's come from space, and scan cars, when Optimus scans the truck that drives by, he didnt look like a Prime like in TF2.

taybrian1...did u like the film? i personally loved it. i saw it twice in Imax. but i still cant decide if it's beter than the first. definately more emotional and funny.

That's a good way of seeing it. If he was a Prime like the ancients, he probably would look like them.

I really loved the film. I can't choose between the two because that is way too hard.

[MovinForward]

The humour IS juvenile - that's just a fact!! I'm sure Bay himself would tell you that! Pot brownies, Wheelie's leg-humping, dog sex (twice), "baby booties", Devastators testicles, Turturro's bare ass, etc etc.

The reason I cite the humour as a possible reason for the poor critical response is that it seems to be what they mention most often in their reviews! (Apart from the Minstrelbots.)

No, not really. Some yes, others no. Immaturity, in my view, is an opinion. What one person may say is juvenile, another may disagree. Such as you and I. I've heard great comedians make jokes around similar thing.

Night at the Museum is rated at 44% at Rotten Tomatoes (a website which takes into account the reviews of critics around the world).

Revenge of the Fallen is sitting at 20%!!

Your point? I already said reviewers aren't always right. I would watch ROFT over Night at the Museum anyday. And not becuase I'm a TF fan.

So...do you respect the critics and value their opinions or don't you? I'm mightily confused!

You can respect someone but not value their opinion. Such as I respect you for say exactly what you think, even though I don't truly value it and it doesn't change the way I think of the movie.

I respect their boldness to make unbiased(most the time), truthful, and sometimes rude reviews. I wouldn't call their job 'fun'. They most likely get a decent amount hate mail from crazy fans after they give a bad review of their favorite movie. However, that doesn't mean I 'believe' their reviews. Just because they say a movie is bad/good doesn't make it bad/good. Last time I checked, that's an opinion, everyone's got one and they're not all the same. Keep up with me here.

Star Trek - 95% (this even had the same writers as TF2!)
WALL-E - 96%
The Dark Knight - 94%

Okay... your point? For one thing, I don't like Star Trek. For another, WALL-E is a a true-blue child's/family movie. And Batman had Heath Ledger, which I'm sure did a great deal for both reviews and movie-goers. Yes, I did like that movie but I have always been a Batman fan, not just for that movie.

Is it too much to ask for similar thought and consideration to be put into a Transformers movie?? I guess it is.

Well, that's your opinion. I can respect that.
And I don't want to start some heated argument or piss Nelson off so let's move on to something more worth our time. And excuse any bad grammar, I just got back from work and I'm not fully here.

[darthrage]

at this point nobody cares about critics

Its a Transformers movie, whether you like the movie or not after you come out of the movie, you still wanted to watch it

the movie is critic proof

Even if someone spread bad word of mouth, people's curiousity and the excitement and controversy will still have people going to watch it

Michael Bay has a winner!!

[carlpickard]

No, not really. Some yes, others no. Immaturity, in my view, is an opinion. What one person may say is juvenile, another may disagree. Such as you and I. I've heard great comedians make jokes around similar thing.

Thanks very much for your reply.

You make an interesting point here, which I think actually serves to emphasise my point that the humour is without question juvenile in the extreme (it was actually referred to as "potty humor" a few posts up; a phrase I haven't heard since I was about 9 years old!).

As you rightly say, great comedians may make jokes and build routines based around, let's say for example, dogs humping. But to craft an actual gag, to structure a comedic work of any sort - takes more than just showing dogs humping and saying to the audience:

"Look! It's dogs! And they're HUMPING~!!!!"

...which to my mind is all this movie does, or even tries to do. The "jokes" in the film aren't even really jokes, as opposed to just crude, lazy references which rely on stereotypes and precognitions.

My point in mentioning Star Trek, Wall-E and The Dark Knight was that it is very possible to take "cult" material like Transformers, do it properly, make a killing at the box office AND A REALLY GOOD MOVIE to boot.

Unfortunately, and clearly, this isn't the case with TF2.

[Morethanmeetstheeye]

I noticed that when Alice was all over Sam, he really didn't want to have anything to do with her, even though I read that he was trying to be friends with her.

I do have one small question (kind of a dumb one but..) when Mikaela found Sam and Alice she broke up with Sam, but when she heard the smashing in the room, did she just end up thinking that Sam wasn't doing anything just being played? I dunno kind of hard to say.

[sora]

For what it's worth - OF COURSE Optimus was a Prime. The clue is in his title - "Optimus PRIME". Jetfire says in disbelief "...a living Prime..." when he's resurrected. As for the "only a Prime can kill a Prime" thing, and Megatron? F*ck knows.

Such a mess.

That line bugged me at first. But I'm not sure whether it was "Only a Prime can kill Prime" or "Only a Prime can kill Fallen". Next time I'll check it out.
In the former case, it's odd that Megatron could kill Optimus, even Ratchet explaind in the novel that he's not dead just in stasis lock (sounds like a "just slept not dead" sleeping beauty).

Latter makes sense. Fallen might have been bound with powers brother Primes cast. So he feared their bloodline. I'd like to see a further information about that in the future.

[Mr Majestic]

Overall one good action movie with loads of eye candy but the story was weaker than the US governments official 9/11 report.

ILM did a fkn great job on the CGI sequences, M Bay needs to hire a whole new writting team and spend a few months learning the art movie making/story telling by spending time with James Cameron and Peter Jackson.

7/10

[redqueenar]

Overall one good action movie with loads of eye candy but the story was weaker than the US governments official 9/11 report.

ILM did a fkn great job on the CGI sequences, M Bay needs to hire a whole new writting team and spend a few months learning the art movie making/story telling by spending time with James Cameron and Peter Jackson.

7/10

Apples, oranges and a kiwi, my son!

James Cameron is famous for having written Aliens, Rambo II and a rewrite of Terminator in the space of three months. That's written, not directed and the record, Cameron and co were sued *successfully* by author Harlan Ellison for using one of his short stories ideas as the basis for the Terminator story. As for Bay, he does a lot of improvisation on set but he doesn't do the writing itself, Kurtzman and Orci were responsible for that. They also had the space of three months in which to write this because of the strike. Somewhere in there they must have composed Star Trek as well. As a writer, when I watch the two films one after the other I see a slight... difference in the work.

Peter Jackson is most famous for having commanded the ship on the Lord of the Rings films. If you've ever read Tolkien you would know that Jackson had an expansive, detailed, singular and sufficiently mythic(!) narrative from which to take his material. The Transformers universes are various, conflicting and often quite dated. One of the complaints I keep hearing about Revenge of the Fallen is how "so-and-so was left out!" It's a miracle so-and-so appeared! Supposedly ILM started their work before the three months of writing happend. They did the design work, they may as well use them! They included an insane number of robots just please the audience (and it seems to have worked)

And LASTLY, there was this guy standing there with Bay named Steven Spielberg, perhaps you've heard of him. I'm really just sincerely touched how none of these critics have tried to throw him under the bus for any of the alleged problems.

[Drake]

Peter Jackson is great at telling other people's stories. Especially when they are already epic and beyond fantastic.

RedQueen hit this little bugger right on the head.

[redqueenar]

Knowing what I know about Cameron, btw, I'm not entirely unconvinced he isn't an evil robot from the future.

[Mech_1000]

After watching this movie for a second time with a much better seat, I have to say seeing it once before ruined nothing about the movie. I still enjoyed every second of it. I withdraw many of my previous complaints about the movie.

I did see it with my brother who hated the first transformers movie. He said he really liked this one. He also said, "After reading so many horrible reviews about this movie, I sat and waited for it to start sucking but that never happened."