Official RoTF discussion thread **PART 2 /Reviews go here** [ SPOILERS ]

[MovinForward]

You know what--I thought that was beautifully done. Someone else was complaining that this movie lacked those beautiful, magical moments that the first one had--like the autobots' arrivial to earth and Ironhide coming out of the swimming pool and the little girl asking if he was the tooth fairy. Things like that. But I thought Sam's death scene when Fox's character was looking down at him with the helicoper above her was one of those moments---but the best was when Sam meets the souls/memories of the first Primes and how the Matrix comes to him/ gathering from the dust. Beautiful.

Ah, that was probably me. I still don't think that holds up to the first. Am I one of the few who didn't cry for Sam? Lol, and to think, after the first movie everyone was hating on Sam and other humans! But really, nothin strikes me as 'beautiful' in the same way TF1 did.

And as some other have stated, the one thing that I despised the most was them DROPPING OP's dead body. Okay, WHAT? No. And the other Autobots just... watch... Huh...

But, looking back, I still like the movie and cannot wait for it to come out on DVD!

PS: Okay, show of hands, who liked the twins? *I do!*

[Trailbreaker]

*raises hand*

[Darth Stitch]

Just to offer a non-American's perspective, the whole "racism" thing about the Twins completely went over my head. It probably did the same for the rest of my countrymen. It wasn't until I thought about what I've read and know about your country's history that I figured it out but still.... well, I just find the Twins annoying on general principle and not because of the way they talk.

I've seen the movie twice now and the audience mostly laughed at everything else but not so much at the Twins. In fact, I could overhear some people cheering when Bee knocked their heads together and threw them out that ancient structure in Petra.

Probably because of the voice actors but really, I just kept recalling Spongebob and Patrick and the rest of the gang under the sea.

[chops]

Bay promised the movie would be darker and it would be where the decepticons would just be dominant and destroying all parts of the world and what not. It was not like that at all. The Fallen was not used nearly enough, didn't kill anyone and did no damage to any 'bots and didn't show anything to be the badass that he supposedly is.

Devastator never killed anyone or any 'bots. No screen time at all. killed by a teenager bot and the humans weapon.

And the biggest thing that bothered me was the transforming. There was hardly any of it. The Twins were behind a curtain for some odd reason when they transformed so we never saw that. we hardly got to see Megs, the Fallen or Starscream transform at all. That's the name of the movie and the franchise - Transformers and that's what they're supposed to do!!!!!!!!!!! I mean really c'mon Bay. When the unicycles or whatever were transforming you couldn't really see it because it too zoomed in or blurry.

There are many good points that I love about the movie but I already talked about them so I had to get this rant out. sorry.

[MovinForward]

Just to offer a non-American's perspective, the whole "racism" thing about the Twins completely went over my head. It probably did the same for the rest of my countrymen. It wasn't until I thought about what I've read and know about your country's history that I figured it out but still.... well, I just find the Twins annoying on general principle and not because of the way they talk.

I've seen the movie twice now and the audience mostly laughed at everything else but not so much at the Twins. In fact, I could overhear some people cheering when Bee knocked their heads together and threw them out that ancient structure in Petra.

Probably because of the voice actors but really, I just kept recalling Spongebob and Patrick and the rest of the gang under the sea.

Well, the guy who does Spongebob also did Skids, I believe.

Bay promised the movie would be darker and it would be where the decepticons would just be dominant and destroying all parts of the world and what not. It was not like that at all. The Fallen was not used nearly enough, didn't kill anyone and did no damage to any 'bots and didn't show anything to be the badass that he supposedly is.

Devastator never killed anyone or any 'bots. No screen time at all. killed by a teenager bot and the humans weapon.

And the biggest thing that bothered me was the transforming. There was hardly any of it. The Twins were behind a curtain for some odd reason when they transformed so we never saw that. we hardly got to see Megs, the Fallen or Starscream transform at all. That's the name of the movie and the franchise - Transformers and that's what they're supposed to do!!!!!!!!!!! I mean really c'mon Bay. When the unicycles or whatever were transforming you couldn't really see it because it too zoomed in or blurry.

There are many good points that I love about the movie but I already talked about them so I had to get this rant out. sorry.

Agree(And the unicycle bots were the 'Arcee' bots.)

[halofan1]

I won't lie, even with my problems with the film I still geeked out when Optimus said "I rise...you fall." Am I the only one who loved that he handed both Megatron and The Fallen their asses in all but six seconds?

[carlpickard]

Okay, show of hands, who liked the twins? *I do!*

But the Twins were included specifically - to quote Michael Bay - for young children!! Don't you think it's weird that the vast majority of posters on this forum found them LOL hilarious.........?? Unless maybe everyone is 6 years old......?

There's a common pattern emerging from almost all of these reviews, and it goes a bit like this: "I LOVED the movie, it's the greatest thing I've EVER SEEN~!!!! But this bit kind of sucked. And so did that bit. And I didn't like this aspect. And that was poorly done. etc etc..."

As an aside, I think this is the worst-reviewed movie I've ever seen - without question the worst-reviewed big-budget movie! Some of Paris Hilton's movies have had better reviews!!

What is it you think that alienates critics? The juvenile humour?

[MovinForward]

But the Twins were included specifically - to quote Michael Bay - for young children!! Don't you think it's weird that the vast majority of posters on this forum found them LOL hilarious.........?? Unless maybe everyone is 6 years old......?

There's a common pattern emerging from almost all of these reviews, and it goes a bit like this: "I LOVED the movie, it's the greatest thing I've EVER SEEN~!!!! But this bit kind of sucked. And so did that bit. And I didn't like this aspect. And that was poorly done. etc etc..."

As an aside, I think this is the worst-reviewed movie I've ever seen - without question the worst-reviewed big-budget movie! Some of Paris Hilton's movies have had better reviews!!

What is it you think that alienates critics? The juvenile humour?

I see. So we obviously have to be immature to like the twins? Or just the all around humor? Juvenile humor, that's good. Well, I'd just like to inform you, I'm 17, made all A's in school, have a job, volunteer, and I enjoyed the humor. I like the twins, because they're different. Does that mean I'm immature or 'juvenile'? No, in fact, it's somewhat hard to make me laugh. Everyone's told me so, and my humor is usually very dry. I don't me to come of rude but sounds like you're directly insulting anyone who enjoyed the humor.
And as for the 'critics' and 'reviews', they aren't always something you should go by. You know that movie Night at The Museum? Yeah. it got horrible reviews by critics and yet people loved it and it now has a sequel. Critics look for every little problem possible. And they nit-pick and nit-pick. But that's their job and I respect them for that. But they're not always right. And I've heard good, bad, and mixed reviews so far, but you know what? Reviews don't matter in the long run, viewers and fans do. I've never let a review tell what movie was good and what was bad. I decide when I see the movie.
Critics will be critics, and they will always be 'alienated' in some way. 'You can please some of the people some of the time, but not all of the people all of the time!'

[darthrage]

But the Twins were included specifically - to quote Michael Bay - for young children!! Don't you think it's weird that the vast majority of posters on this forum found them LOL hilarious.........?? Unless maybe everyone is 6 years old......?

There's a common pattern emerging from almost all of these reviews, and it goes a bit like this: "I LOVED the movie, it's the greatest thing I've EVER SEEN~!!!! But this bit kind of sucked. And so did that bit. And I didn't like this aspect. And that was poorly done. etc etc..."

As an aside, I think this is the worst-reviewed movie I've ever seen - without question the worst-reviewed big-budget movie! Some of Paris Hilton's movies have had better reviews!!

What is it you think that alienates critics? The juvenile humour?

regardless of whether they spoke in crude language that is PG-13, the Twins are still for kids. A parent will say that the Twins are NOT for kids but kids love characters that are like that. For people who are parents, don't think that your kids are all innocent and angels. Depending on their age, some of them could already have those words in their vocabulary when you're not around. And plus the designs of the Twins are very goofy, which appeals to kids.

Michael Bay had every intention to market that aspect of the movie/characters to kids and he was right on the mark with that because honestly, this is what kids want to see. It might not be agreeable with parents but I am positive that the kid's liked it and found them thoroughly amusing.

Even if they don't get the potty jokes, the scenes of them fighting and acting like brothers is entertaining to them.

[darthrage]

I was close, but didn't fully blow into tears.

The only time I got emotional was when the parents and sam were in the dessert together and his dad said "we all go together" and he had a problem with letting his son go. You really feel how difficult it is for the parent separating from his son. It gets to me every time.

[carlpickard]

the scenes of them fighting and acting like brothers is entertaining to them.

[MovinForward]

Gotta' love sibling rivalry.

[darthrage]

You know how Jerry Maguire had her at "hello" ??

Well, I think the Twins had the kids at the Ice Cream truck speaking with a Spongebob voice

HAHA!

[MovinForward]

You know how Jerry Maguire had her at "hello" ??

Well, I think the Twins had the kids at the Ice Cream truck speaking with a Spongebob voice

HAHA!

Lol!
Spongebob+Icecream truck=Ever child's dream(well, almost every)

And I hate Spongebob. Lol.

[carlpickard]

I see. So we obviously have to be immature to like the twins? Or just the all around humor? Juvenile humor, that's good.

The humour IS juvenile - that's just a fact!! I'm sure Bay himself would tell you that! Pot brownies, Wheelie's leg-humping, dog sex (twice), "baby booties", Devastators testicles, Turturro's bare ass, etc etc.

The reason I cite the humour as a possible reason for the poor critical response is that it seems to be what they mention most often in their reviews! (Apart from the Minstrelbots.)

And as for the 'critics' and 'reviews', they aren't always something you should go by. You know that movie Night at The Museum? Yeah. it got horrible reviews by critics and yet people loved it and it now has a sequel.

Night at the Museum is rated at 44% at Rotten Tomatoes (a website which takes into account the reviews of critics around the world).

Revenge of the Fallen is sitting at 20%!!

Critics look for every little problem possible. And they nit-pick and nit-pick. But that's their job and I respect them for that.

So...do you respect the critics and value their opinions or don't you? I'm mightily confused!

Critics will be critics, and they will always be 'alienated' in some way. 'You can please some of the people some of the time, but not all of the people all of the time!'

Star Trek - 95% (this even had the same writers as TF2!)
WALL-E - 96%
The Dark Knight - 94%

Is it too much to ask for similar thought and consideration to be put into a Transformers movie?? I guess it is.

[Trailbreaker]

As an aside, I think this is the worst-reviewed movie I've ever seen - without question the worst-reviewed big-budget movie! Some of Paris Hilton's movies have had better reviews!!

Wait, Paris Hilton makes movies?

[highdefw]

Surprisingly yes. She did that House of Wax of whatever it's called.

What I don't get is, why do critics go into a Michael Bay movie expecting some over the top story with acting. Haven't they learned by now that Bay's films are strictly eye candy? It's a good way to spend 2 hours on a friday night. That's why I'm hating these critics...

[carlpickard]

Surprisingly yes. She did that House of Wax of whatever it's called.

...which global critical concensus would have as better than Revenge of the Fallen.

[wingzero]

Bay promised the movie would be darker and it would be where the decepticons would just be dominant and destroying all parts of the world and what not. It was not like that at all. The Fallen was not used nearly enough, didn't kill anyone and did no damage to any 'bots and didn't show anything to be the badass that he supposedly is.

Devastator never killed anyone or any 'bots. No screen time at all. killed by a teenager bot and the humans weapon.

And the biggest thing that bothered me was the transforming. There was hardly any of it. The Twins were behind a curtain for some odd reason when they transformed so we never saw that. we hardly got to see Megs, the Fallen or Starscream transform at all. That's the name of the movie and the franchise - Transformers and that's what they're supposed to do!!!!!!!!!!! I mean really c'mon Bay. When the unicycles or whatever were transforming you couldn't really see it because it too zoomed in or blurry.

There are many good points that I love about the movie but I already talked about them so I had to get this rant out. sorry.

On the missing mass destruction scenes thing and the character of The Fallen not utilized that much you are right but the movie is still darker than the first one with some horror elements. By the simple fact that for unknown reasons even the Showest Sneak Peak Footage scene of Bumblebee in the garage was shortened on the final theatrical cut I would say that there are many more little finalized scenes probably even quite dark that they didn't had to the final cut. I really hope that an Extended Version/Director's Cut release with all finalized deleted scenes will be released on Blu-Ray and not just with IMAX scenes integrated into it. There are some cuts at points in the movie that clearly tell that something is missing there... I don't know why they thought that cutting out the Bumblebee sentence asking Sam in the garage "what is your purpose... Sam?" was a good thing to do because it was not. The Sneak Peak Footage for that scene was perfect, why did they decide to have it shortened? I hope to see it fully reintegrated in the Blu-Ray release along with all the finalized deleted scenes that can be added. For the disc release there is no too long runtime issue like in theaters, so even if the movie would end up lasting 165minutes or so it would only sell more and not less, Michael Bay and his crew along with Paramount can be sure from now that all the finalized deleted scenes added back to the movie, reintegrated inside it for a longer overall runtime (and not as separated selectable deleted scenes that only a few would watch) would make the movie sell a lot more copies on Blu-Ray and if those deleted scenes are as good as the Bumblebee piece questioning Sam then a lot more people would even get a better feeling from the extended movie version.

Then, on the whole lack of transformations and blurry thing you are wrong. Did you watch it in a theater with a classical film projector? Because if that is the case then that is the culprit. Those projectors kill the movie. I watched it both in a theater that had the film projector and then in one with a Digital2K DLP projector and the difference is absolutely huge. It's like watching two different movies. In my country there are no IMAX theaters unfortunately but obviously who is lucky enough to watch it on IMAX is able to feel the movie experience even more.

There are a lot of transformations thruout the movie, and nothing is blurry when you watch the Digital2K source in a theater with a good digital projector.

[Bumblebee1983]

On the missing mass destruction scenes thing and the character of The Fallen not utilized that much you are right but the movie is still darker than the first one with some horror elements. By the simple fact that for unknown reasons even the Showest Sneak Peak Footage scene of Bumblebee in the garage was shortened on the final theatrical cut I would say that there are many more little finalized scenes probably even quite dark that they didn't had to the final cut. I really hope that an Extended Version/Director's Cut release with all finalized deleted scenes will be released on Blu-Ray and not just with IMAX scenes integrated into it. There are some cuts at points in the movie that clearly tell that something is missing there... I don't know why they thought that cutting out the Bumblebee sentence asking Sam in the garage "what is your purpose... Sam?" was a good thing to do because it was not. The Sneak Peak Footage for that scene was perfect, why did they decide to have it shortened? I hope to see it fully reintegrated in the Blu-Ray release along with all the finalized deleted scenes that can be added. For the disc release there is no too long runtime issue like in theaters, so even if the movie would end up lasting 165minutes or so it would only sell more and not less, Michael Bay and his crew along with Paramount can be sure from now that all the finalized deleted scenes added back to the movie, reintegrated inside it for a longer overall runtime (and not as separated selectable deleted scenes that only a few would watch) would make the movie sell a lot more copies on Blu-Ray and if those deleted scenes are as good as the Bumblebee piece questioning Sam then a lot more people would even get a better feeling from the extended movie version.

Then, on the whole lack of transformations and blurry thing you are wrong. Did you watch it in a theater with a classical film projector? Because if that is the case then that is the culprit. Those projectors kill the movie. I watched it both in a theater that had the film projector and then in one with a Digital2K DLP projector and the difference is absolutely huge. It's like watching two different movies. In my country there are no IMAX theaters unfortunately but obviously who is lucky enough to watch it on IMAX is able to feel the movie experience even more.

There are a lot of transformations thruout the movie, and nothing is blurry when you watch the Digital2K source in a theater with a good digital projector.

I, for one, thought the transformations were much better done in this one than the first one. ILM had time to perfect them.

I read on IMDB that one ILM developer was working on a rendering of Soundwave and overloaded his computer.

That takes a HELL of a lot of memory and power to do that!!!

[halofan1]

Ok, TRANSFORMERS 2 might not be the greatest film (and PUBLIC ENEMIES makes it repeat every grade since pre-school) but worse than the shit that is HOUSE OF WAX? Come on now...

[enfweygo]

Finally got to see this movie. Loved it! Please, Michael Bay, don't make us wait longer than 2012 for the 3rd installment. I don't have any complaints. Everyone seems to have a problem with plot, but I thought it was great, and of course action is always great in Bay films. I grew up during the Transformers era, but I can't stand all the nerds comparing. Great movie, can't wait to see it again.

[carlpickard]

There are a lot of transformations thruout the movie, and nothing is blurry when you watch the Digital2K source in a theater with a good digital projector.

That's simply untrue.

In both movies much of the transformations are blurry - indeed the crowd I went to see Revenge of the Fallen with found it incredibly difficult to tell the robots apart (with the exception of Flamey Prime and yellow Bumblebee). All the Decepticons were just generic grey blobs.

[carlpickard]

Ok, TRANSFORMERS 2 might not be the greatest film (and PUBLIC ENEMIES makes it repeat every grade since pre-school) but worse than the shit that is HOUSE OF WAX? Come on now...

So sayeth 187 people from around the globe whose job it is to review movies...

[halofan1]

So sayeth 187 people from around the globe whose job it is to review movies...

Unreal.