Jeremy Clarkson on the Honda Insight

[Z28 Autobot]

http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/dri...cle6294116.ece

3 page article, but here's the jist of it:

So here goes. It’s terrible. Biblically terrible. Possibly the worst new car money can buy. It’s the first car I’ve ever considered crashing into a tree, on purpose, so I didn’t have to drive it any more.

and sums up what I been telling all the "World savers" out there about these cars..its a scam!! Your Prius is not saving the enviroment one bit! Same goes for the Insight...

The nickel for the battery has to come from somewhere. Canada, usually. It has to be shipped to Japan, not on a sailing boat, I presume. And then it must be converted, not in a tree house, into a battery, and then that battery must be transported, not on an ox cart, to the Insight production plant in Suzuka. And then the finished car has to be shipped, not by Thor Heyerdahl, to Britain, where it can be transported, not by wind, to the home of a man with a beard who thinks he’s doing the world a favour.

[Trailbreaker]

Reading this, it sounds more like to me that this Jeremy Clarkson is writing an angry rant rather than a review. Motor cans? Smugmobiles? He needs to take a chill pill. This "review" is full of bias.

Though I can agree environmentally they may not be helpful, this guy does not mention anywhere about the average Joe buying it for the sole purpose of saving money on gas. Not all people buy hybrids to be environmentalists.

Let's see what this guy has to say about it. It ain't blind praise and it isn't without it's criticisms, but at least I could stand reading it: http://www.usatoday.com/money/autos/...-insight_N.htm

So to sum it up, it's a hybrid, what do you expect?

[nelson]

SO I guess we should all buy Hummers and keep polluting the earth....

[ScarCrow28]

That's basically the same argument Jeremy gives the Prius.


Perhaps THIS is the Honda we should be talking about.

http://www.topgear.com/us/videos/mor...-honda-clarity

The additional article here:
http://www.topgear.com/us/features/m...a-fcx-clarity/

Green cars are not a scam. Its a developing solution to a serious problem.

[nelson]

http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/dri...cle6294116.ece

3 page article, but here's the jist of it:





and sums up what I been telling all the "World savers" out there about these cars..its a scam!! Your Prius is not saving the enviroment one bit! Same goes for the Insight...

The Insight (a car that came out in the mid 90s) has always been a suck-ass car, so bad example.

It's the equivalent of me bringing up the Chevy Citation in a conversation of amazing Americam cars.

[nelson]

That's basically the same argument Jeremy gives the Prius.


Perhaps THIS is the Honda we should be talking about.

http://www.topgear.com/us/videos/mor...-honda-clarity

The additional article here:
http://www.topgear.com/us/features/m...a-fcx-clarity/

Green cars are not a scam. Its a developing solution to a serious problem.

It's a scam when people like z28 don't want to give their man-defining gas guzzlers. I mean, literally, the guy will point you out to articles that argue (or attempt to due so by ignoring science) that a Hummer saves more gas than a Prius.

[ScarCrow28]

It's a scam when people like z28 don't want to give their man-defining gas guzzlers. I mean, literally, the guy will point you out to articles that argue (or attempt to due so by ignoring science) that a Hummer saves more gas than a Prius.

That may depend on how you drive it.

http://www.topgear.com/us/videos/more/thirsty-prius/

What good is a "green car" if the they way you drive isn't "granny style"? Sure that test is an exaggeration, but it does sport some truth to the total problem. The Prius is great if you hate driving in the first place. It's not a "drivers" car. It's not a "car buffs" car.

Seems to me that the real motive behind the arguments like z28 gives is that this big push towards green cars will ultimately mean the demise of performance cars if the only way to be "green" is to drive a boring piece of crap. ( from a performance & fun-to-drive point of view ) There is nothing wrong with saying that the Prius & Insight are "not good enough". Because in a way they aren't. They only market to one specific audience. I know I wouldn't buy one. I don't like them. But at the same time I respect their importance and the science behind them. I keep saying that to myself every time I brisky pass one on the I4 because they are annoyingly blocking the fast lane. The technology just isn't ready for the general market. You can't force the "one size fits all" thinking on billions and billions of world consumers.

I mean, if you wanted to drive a Prius or an Insight like you would a Mustang / Camaro / M3 etc... you would not only be greatly disappointed in the car's performance & efficiency, you would be defeating the purpose that these cars are designed for in the first place. Which is not performance! And there isn't any "green car" alternative for what Hummers and Land Rovers were really designed for. Which to many folk's dismay is not rap videos and Ego fluffers. They really were intended to go off roading. I have yet to see a production model "clean energy" off road vehicle. No the Escape and the 400h don't really count since they are more or less cars with high ground clearance, in case you wan to drive out onto the baseball field to deliver pizza to the little league.

The problem with a performance car enthusiast's usual argument against green cars is that it is shortsighted. The same goes towards criticism against those who criticize the Prius and Insight. It again is shortsighted. The criticism needs to be, "Where are the performance green cars? And where are the off-road green cars?" Again, it's a mistake to force a Prius on a market other then the eco car segment. The problem is not the technology, its the execution of that technology.

I highly doubt that performance cars are at all endangered. And when I keep seeing arguments about which v8 powered vehicle has been scrapped because "government is forcing boring green cars on us" I have to shake my head. The real reason behind those decisions is because the car companies stretched themselves too thin, forgot how to run a successful company, and in turn went begging to the government for help. They wouldn't have to cancel those performance car plans if they had planned for the long run instead of satisfying the short term greed of shareholders who only respond to get -richer- quickly- above- all- else thinking.

Of course the government is going to put crazy rules upon the money they loan out! The government doesn't want to be in the auto business as much we don't want them to be. ( Same with Wall Street & the banks. )Its a punishment on the automakers and their shareholders/ unions etc for being so damn greedy and shortsighted. Maybe next time they will learn how to run a business more effectively and co-operate better so they won't have to ask for bailouts. Don't want the government to put their hands all over your business? Then stop being greedy, run your business responsibly by planing ahead and they won't have to! Simply as that.

Getting back to the current topic, I have to point to Ford and their efforts to keep performance ( or should I say finally introduce performance ) into their lineup while still paying attention and addressing the mpg problem. When was the last time we heard of a 330 horsepower engine making at least 24mpg highway? Put that engine in a smaller, lighter car and you could do even better. I mean this v6 engine already does better then the 4.6 v8 currently in the smaller and lighter-weighing Mustang GT.

http://wot.motortrend.com/6542579/au...585/index.html

Is it a solution to the global warming problem? Of course not. But at least they are paying attention and keeping a business afloat by addressing both consumer demands and climate & political responsibility. It's not yet enough, but they are showing that they "get it" They are certainly doing more then the Coal Industry is. Which is just as bad a contributor, if not worse. The coal industry intends to sit on their ass waiting for the government to do their job for them.... 50 years from now when it will already be too late.

http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2009/...n4964301.shtml

The bottom line is we do have to start somewhere. And the Prius can't be ignored or childishly tossed aside. At the same time, it can't be expected to be widely adopted by the masses as the miracle car. I would never buy a Prius or Insight because my SE-R Spec V is much more fun to drive, and I love driving way to much torture myself with Prius -preformance and styling. It's not that I don't want to be eco friendly. Because I actually do. But until the car companies can offer me a Tesla Roadster I can afford I'll just have to do my part by trying really hard not to mash the gas so much on my car I have now.

[Z28 Autobot]

SO I guess we should all buy Hummers and keep polluting the earth....

I like how you go to the opposite end of the spectrum of the auto world..and guess what the Hummer is not the worst out there..but I wont get into that..Who's polluting the earth? a low selling nitch vehicle..or people that are mis informed about what they are really buying??

The Insight (a car that came out in the mid 90s) has always been a suck-ass car, so bad example.

It's the equivalent of me bringing up the Chevy Citation in a conversation of amazing Americam cars.

Well it would be if Chevy brought out the Citation again..but they are not...and bring up anything you want man..It was Clarkson that is talking about the Insight not me not you..

It's a scam when people like z28 don't want to give their man-defining gas guzzlers. I mean, literally, the guy will point you out to articles that argue (or attempt to due so by ignoring science) that a Hummer saves more gas than a Prius.

I don't know how to respond to the first part Nelson..but thanks for the attempt..wrong but thanks..
and yes thanks for bringing that back up..you mean the thread where you said I "made it up" on many of the things I posted..basically calling me a liar..and to back what up I said with articles or actual facts on the problems..I did on 99% of them though, I do remember I did misrepresent one thing...sorry..
yet I did not hear a good strong argument out of you after that, what I posted on what you said I lied about???..in fact why not pull that post back up so that everyone can see that Prius and Hummer article..your misrepresenting what I posted to suit your own thoughts and not how it reads.
I have always said If I post something out of context or wrong let me know Im nor anyone is perfect or knows everything about everything...but I would like to think I have a little more insight (pun intended) and contacts than the regualr joe...but if something is presented to you more than once ya gotta look at it and see it for what it is..

[Z28 Autobot]

That may depend on how you drive it.

I wont quote your whole post..but I did read it..and the thing is contrary to opinions by people on here I am not a gaz guzzler or nothing person..in fact if anyone cared to notice that many of these "gas guzzlers" have gotten better.
The performance side of it..look what a 400+HP Vette can get for MPG..it gets 26MPG. Many of the LSX engines in GM's lineup get high 20's to over 30's. with amazing HP numbers to boot..
and a personal note this is why I got my GXP..I was looking for a 4 door..but also wanted performance AND fuel economy..the GXP fit that. a fully loaded 4 door full size car that has 303HP goes 0-60 in 5.5 seconds and on the personal side gets 30+MPG highway with its active fuel management..my cars "gas guzzling" V8 turns into a 4 banger on highway runs... I looked into mopar for its cars with thier DOD with the Charger. There are performance options out there..heck the 304 HP V6 Camaro gets 29MPG..
Now go along with the SUV crowed..this is what I am talking about its easy to make a 40MPG car out of something like the Prius..heck Honda has been doing it for years back in the 90's the civic was getting 40's..as well as many other cars without this magical electric drive.

Making practical people movers better is a step GM has made..tell me that making a huge Escalade or Suburban better in city MPG than a toyota camry..thats saying something..
Or like you pointed out..Fords electric drives are revolutionary to what the Prius has in it. kinda how the Fusion gets 41MPG a mid size car....Like I have said and will say it again..The prius is not a green car..how its made is very damaging to the enviroment..and then the disposal of this car..but im not going to get into the problems that people know about the Prius but we have never viewed or glossed over since Toyota has the golden boy rep..when your good you can sweep this things under the rug..and they have.




Scarecrow..in fact I am huge into alternative fuel cars..I love electric. hybrid and flex fuel and hydrogen cars...if done right its somethign I am into..I also love my perofrmance cars..sure as you can tell. and they have a spot in the future..

I can tell you this..I know the gas engine is going to be gone maybe as soon as my lifetime..Im not shunning the advancement away..like some thing so..but I want people to know that these green leaf people ignore things when somepeople point it out..and yell HUMMER HUMMER..yea well again a nitch vehicle thats intent is 4x4 is not the problem its the idea that people think it is..

[Z28 Autobot]

And GM's not doing to bad on thier non hybrid car based SUV's..

32MPG..

2010 Chevrolet Equinox Expected to Achieve 32 MPG Highway - Car News

Highway mileage would top even that of the Ford Escape hybrid.

http://www.caranddriver.com/reviews/...ghway_car_news