The Official Bank Closure thread

[nelson]

http://www.nytimes.com/2008/09/15/bu.../15lehman.html

This shit happening too often now. Where are conservatives when we have government (which they say should be small) bailing out these banks that preyed on people through unethical lending?

In one of the most dramatic days in Wall Street’s history, Merrill Lynch agreed to sell itself on Sunday to Bank of America for roughly $50 billion to avert a deepening financial crisis, while another prominent securities firm, Lehman Brothers, filed for bankruptcy protection and hurtled toward liquidation after it failed to find a buyer.

It appears Conservatives favor helping huge corporations but not the poor. We've become the hub for corporate welfare.

[ScarCrow28]

While I agree this is a freaking Gong Show of a catastrophe, I'm not so sure you can say the Government bailed these two giants this weekend.

The Fed has indeed come to the aid of Bear Sterns back in March. And most recently Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac. But from what I understood, Lehman Brother's plea for Government help was denied Sunday evening, forcing them to hunt for a buyer. When no other company came to the table, they were forced into bankruptcy.

Bank of America bought Merrill Lynch. But I don't recall details where they got government help to do so. The article mentions AIG also pleading for Government aid. But as of this post I don't think they have gotten any answer.


But regardless, the outlook is quite bleak. I'm surprised no one is still officially calling our economy a Recession, when it appears to me, giants like this would not fall unless we were under a depression. I'm not exactly sure how this ripples down to the rest of the economy (besides the obvious stock market effects ) But this might be the big finale.

The big question is what happens when the firesale runs out of assets?

[Beej]

Well, it's either that or some company in China or Dubai bails them out, or maybe Bill Gates or Warren Buffett.

The money went somewhere didn't it? CEOs of Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac were canned, but you didn't hear about the golden parachutes, but they did deploy -- the only way they didn't deploy was if there was fraud charges brought forth, which did not happen.

It is still called personal responsibility. It wasn't government or corporations or speculators that caused the problem, it was individual greed. Who else do you have in mind to clean up the mess?

We are the heroes of our own stories. There is no such thing as a white knight coming to the rescue.

[BeetleJuice]

Dow Jones -4.41%, 6th worst drop ever. Nasdaq just as bad, the mess is global. Sick, Gutted. This is no joke. Agree with nelson, some people are screwed.

[BeetleJuice]

AIG is hurting: http://www.nytimes.com/2008/09/16/bu.../16aig.html?hp

The Federal Reserve has asked two investment banks, JPMorgan Chase and Goldman Sachs, to put together at least $70 billion in loans to help prop up the American International Group, the giant insurance company

At this rate any change the future government could bring will be to late.
It's NOT just another market adjustment. Some guys are getting really nervous.
If Obama has a miracle solution, I'm ready to hear it.

[Trailbreaker]

Fantastic, now we have two political/economic threads.

[BeetleJuice]

Fantastic, now we have two political/economic threads.

nope, not really. This thread is way more depressing, it's suicidal

[nelson]

Dow Jones -4.41%, 6th worst drop ever. Nasdaq just as bad, the mess is global. Sick, Gutted. This is no joke. Agree with nelson, some people are screwed.

But McCain declares that the fundamentals of our economy are strong!!!

[BeetleJuice]

But McCain declares that the fundamentals of our economy are strong!!!

I don't get it. Why is McCain gaining in the polls?
A couple things changed for me today, for all I'm a Republican and all, this is serious shit.
Asia falling, Nikkei 225 -4.8 percent. It's bad.

[BeetleJuice]

Hank Paulson is an idiot, I hate the guy.

[Trailbreaker]

Hank Paulson is an idiot, I hate the guy.

Elaborate please.

[BeetleJuice]

Elaborate please.

Hank Paulson is US treasury secretary, head of United States department of the Treasury. These are the guys who deal with finance and monetary.
Hank Paulson is mega close to George Bush, like almost in bed with him.
He used to run Goldman Sachs, the investment bank that has made billions from deals with Chinese companies.
It works like this:
Low cost imports from China kept inflation rates in the US at an unnaturally low level.
Because of this central banks maintained lower interest rates. Remember the rise in house prices for example would not make that sensible.
The Chinese maintained the yaun low against the dollar, allowing continued cheap imports.
Amongst the biggest buyers of bonds in Freddie Mac and Fannie Mae is the Chinese government, using the Peoples Bank of China.
Anyway you get the picture, I could go on and on.
Hank Paulson has failed to find a buyer for Lehman Brothers. He refused to allow a government buyout of the company.
This idiot played with the Chinese to make fortunes, it's a disaster for the Republicans. How can we justify his actions? The man is a criminal.

[BeetleJuice]

"The Worst is Just Beginning"... this was back in February.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ETQj3...eature=related

[Trailbreaker]

Hank Paulson is US treasury secretary, head of United States department of the Treasury. These are the guys who deal with finance and monetary.
Hank Paulson is mega close to George Bush, like almost in bed with him.
He used to run Goldman Sachs, the investment bank that has made billions from deals with Chinese companies.
It works like this:
Low cost imports from China kept inflation rates in the US at an unnaturally low level.
Because of this central banks maintained lower interest rates. Remember the rise in house prices for example would not make that sensible.
The Chinese maintained the yaun low against the dollar, allowing continued cheap imports.
Amongst the biggest buyers of bonds in Freddie Mac and Fannie Mae is the Chinese government, using the Peoples Bank of China.
Anyway you get the picture, I could go on and on.
Hank Paulson has failed to find a buyer for Lehman Brothers. He refused to allow a government buyout of the company.
This idiot played with the Chinese to make fortunes, it's a disaster for the Republicans. How can we justify his actions? The man is a criminal.

He also said he wanted to address the issue about the wide gap between the the rich and the poor. Well, when you work for the guy who is causing that I just find that laughable.

[BeetleJuice]

He also said he wanted to address the issue about the wide gap between the the rich and the poor. Well, when you work for the guy who is causing that I just find that laughable.

He's a hypocrite, and a liar.
Try this:

Sunday, July 13, 2008

U.S. Treasury Secretary Henry Paulson signaled that a government takeover of Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac won't be necessary, saying they should continue as shareholder-owned companies with federal charters.

"Today our primary focus is supporting Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac in their current form as they carry out their important mission," Paulson said in a statement in Washington.

Paulson's remarks indicate he wants to reassure shareholders they won't be wiped out by any government efforts to ensure the stability of the firms that own or guarantee almost half the $12 trillion in U.S. mortgages.

:deadhorse1::deadhorse1::deadhorse1:

[Beej]

AIG's future was foretold when Elliot Spitzer put the white hot light on them and what was going on in that industry.

This isn't a Kingdom run by a royal family, or a dictatorship.

There is no ONE person to blame for the greed and sickness that has taken place across the board. From the people who sold home loans to people who couldn't afford to live in a house whose price was unrealistic. Supply and demand. People signed up for loans with no money down knowing full well they'd not be able to afford it within two years unless they got it refinanced, got paid more money, or sold it for a profit -- which do you think they were all banking on?

The people in the mortgage industry who sold those loans didn't give a crap if they were selling bad loans, stated (no documents) or otherwise, so long as they made quota and got bonuses. Executives didn't give a crap because it didn't matter as long as they got paid, and were doing well. And so on, and so on, and so on. And then shit rolled down the hill.

You can't blame your government for the greed of mankind. Everybody got greedy on this from the family that sold their home for three times what they bought it for in 2002, to the family in the home they shouldn't have bought all the way to the top rung of the corporate world and the speculators on Wall Street. Nobody gets to walk away from this without getting dirt on their hands.

It's not someone else's fault -- IT'S OUR OWN FAULT. The system isn't broken -- it was us, we the people broke it. And now ALL of us get to pay for it one way or another.

The memo on Bear Stearns CDO problem wasn't meant to get out... it was leaked, and no one believed or could understand just how deep the CDO market debacle was... or is still going. It's still happening. Why? Because there is money to be made. Just like there is with Mazut, which is too ugly and horrific for the masses to comprehend because we'd all slice our wrists if we knew how deep the greed and sickness goes; and it's not just here in this country. We'd all throw up and give up and say what's the point if we really knew the whole truth. It's a little bit like drugs -- it's an industry that is strong for a reason, and it's called greed. Everybody wants some.

[The Great]

While I agree this is a freaking Gong Show of a catastrophe, I'm not so sure you can say the Government bailed these two giants this weekend.

The Fed has indeed come to the aid of Bear Sterns back in March. And most recently Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac. But from what I understood, Lehman Brother's plea for Government help was denied Sunday evening, forcing them to hunt for a buyer. When no other company came to the table, they were forced into bankruptcy.

Bank of America bought Merrill Lynch. But I don't recall details where they got government help to do so. The article mentions AIG also pleading for Government aid. But as of this post I don't think they have gotten any answer.


But regardless, the outlook is quite bleak. I'm surprised no one is still officially calling our economy a Recession, when it appears to me, giants like this would not fall unless we were under a depression. I'm not exactly sure how this ripples down to the rest of the economy (besides the obvious stock market effects ) But this might be the big finale.

The big question is what happens when the firesale runs out of assets?

If the government stepped in for fannie mae and freddie mac to take over their companies that is a bail out. The governement helped broker the deal between bank of america and merrill lynch so essentially they bailed merrill out also. so the government has had a huge hand in all of this.

[The Great]

I don't get it. Why is McCain gaining in the polls?
A couple things changed for me today, for all I'm a Republican and all, this is serious shit.
Asia falling, Nikkei 225 -4.8 percent. It's bad.

I don't understand why you ask that considering you are a republican. he is gaining in the polls because election is about popularity and not issues. He has got a woman on his arm who can talk tough with no substance at all and people think she is hot, a regular person just like them and a good mom. Don't know what that has to do running the economy.

[BeetleJuice]

I don't understand why you ask that considering you are a republican. he is gaining in the polls because election is about popularity and not issues. He has got a woman on his arm who can talk tough with no substance at all and people think she is hot, a regular person just like them and a good mom. Don't know what that has to do running the economy.

Neo cons actually have a left liberal origin.
Paul Wolfowitz backed senator Henry Jackson during the 1970s for the democratic party presidential nomination.
It’s complicated. Max Boot is a great guy(read The Savage Wars of Peace), we could never trust the Democrats with foreign policy, remember the Mogadishu fiasco? Clinton’s fault. That would’t have happened under George Bush.
But I agree this country needs fixing, asap. Something’s gone wrong. The economy is a disaster, so expect Obama to win.

[BeetleJuice]

$85 Billion for AIG: http://www.nytimes.com/2008/09/17/bu...hp&oref=slogin

http://www.federalreserve.gov/newsev.../20080916a.htm
The Federal Reserve Board on Tuesday, with the full support of the Treasury Department, authorized the Federal Reserve Bank of New York to lend up to $85 billion to the American International Group (AIG) under section 13(3) of the Federal Reserve Act. The secured loan has terms and conditions designed to protect the interests of the U.S. government and taxpayers.

[ScarCrow28]

From the Today Show


Jim Cramer on AIG

Love the part from 2007. Just awesome.

[BeetleJuice]

Barclays buys Lehman: http://edition.cnn.com/2008/BUSINESS...ets/index.html

[nelson]

remember the Mogadishu fiasco? Clinton’s fault. That would’t have happened under George Bush.

No, Iraq is what happened under Gerge Bush.

I think it's funny when conservatives forget to mention the Kosovo war. Gues how many American soldiers died in that one? Zero.

[nelson]

From the Today Show


Jim Cramer on AIG

Love the part from 2007. Just awesome.

We can thanks Allan Greenspan and John McCain's from financial campaign advisor—Phil Gramm—for a lot of this.

[Trailbreaker]

Wow, things are looking pretty rough at Wall Street. Brace yourselves on the rise of prices on, well, pretty much everything.

I guess this is why Nelson stickied this thread. It seems like it's just gonna keep on going like this. I certainly hope not.