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Thread: Why The Contempt?

  1. #1
    Junior Member King's Avatar
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    Default Why The Contempt?

    I'm new here so assuming this a fair question to ask on the official Bay board...

    a question I've always wanted to pose in an open forum

    why is there so much fu<king hated for Michael Bay, it's only become aparent in the past few years but it seems the mere mention of his name in any film forum or news site garners (excuse the pun) flames upon flames or red painted flames...

    until i started seeing the hate for myself, i figured he be one of the most cherished film makers around, i mean critics hate fun awesome films but genre fans and (aint it) cool film lovers one and all have so much contempt for the man and his films

    that being said, he has lots of supporters...(mtv just voted in their love for him)

    the question is, it is just a case of wanting to be cool and fit and while secretly enjoying bad boys one?
    or do this drones of ppl really think the films are a waste of their time?

    the G1 fans i can understand...however misguided, i can understand...

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    Senior Member Bumblebee1983's Avatar
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    Default Re: Why The Contempt?

    Quote Originally Posted by King View Post
    I'm new here so assuming this a fair question to ask on the official Bay board...

    a question I've always wanted to pose in an open forum

    why is there so much fu<king hated for Michael Bay, it's only become aparent in the past few years but it seems the mere mention of his name in any film forum or news site garners (excuse the pun) flames upon flames or red painted flames...

    until i started seeing the hate for myself, i figured he be one of the most cherished film makers around, i mean critics hate fun awesome films but genre fans and (aint it) cool film lovers one and all have so much contempt for the man and his films

    that being said, he has lots of supporters...(mtv just voted in their love for him)

    the question is, it is just a case of wanting to be cool and fit and while secretly enjoying bad boys one?
    or do this drones of ppl really think the films are a waste of their time?

    the G1 fans i can understand...however misguided, i can understand...
    I honestly believe those people you mentioned in your post are jealous.

    They are jealous of the millions he makes, and they want him to fail.

    I think it's just that simple.
    I'm a dog chasing cars. I don't know what I'd do if I caught one. I don't have plans. I just do things. I'm not a schemer.

    I use a knife because guns are too quick. Otherwise, you can't savor all the emotions. You know who people are in their last moments.

    I believe whatever doesn't kill you simply makes you... stranger.



  3. #3
    Senior Member Trailbreaker's Avatar
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    Default Re: Why The Contempt?

    All that matters is that Bay loves what he does and nay sayers don't bother him.

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    Senior Member Bumblebee1983's Avatar
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    Default Re: Why The Contempt?

    Quote Originally Posted by Trailbreaker View Post
    All that matters is that Bay loves what he does and nay sayers don't bother him.
    True.

    And he has to have a thick skin to deal with the wankers. I admire that.
    I'm a dog chasing cars. I don't know what I'd do if I caught one. I don't have plans. I just do things. I'm not a schemer.

    I use a knife because guns are too quick. Otherwise, you can't savor all the emotions. You know who people are in their last moments.

    I believe whatever doesn't kill you simply makes you... stranger.



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    Default Re: Why The Contempt?

    It's just a matter of being cool, which to me is alarming because if your love for film isn't honest then you can fuck off. I was on Rotten Tomatoes in the times of Transformers release and they were quite a lot of people who referred to the movie as an ordeal, the cinematic equivalent to toxic waste and piles of poop and gave the movie 1/10 etc. At the same time they refer to Michael as arrogant, egomaniac, racist, retarded, misogynist, shallow etc. The hate for him is quite astounding I must say. Of course, these people still see his movies the day they open so Michael shouldn't be alarmed

    It's almost like an obsession. The religious Bay-haters. The fact that all these juvenile, hating, stubborn film nazis actually exists in real life scares me sometimes. What it all comes down to though is that Michael only makes bombastic, shallow popcorn movies. Even it he did something small - and did it good - and all the critics loved it there would still be a group of people refusing to like the film just because he directed it. Some guys don't even give him a chance anymore. It's hard enjoying a film if you walk in to it with the most negative mindset and a contempt for the director itself.

    People that aren't honest about their opinions be it movies, music, whatever and do the poser thing and just say what everyone is saying ("Oh, Bays movies are just stupid and there's no character development there at all") because it's a hip thing to say on a internet message board are just a tool in my eyes.

  6. #6
    Senior Member Trigger Mike's Avatar
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    Default Re: Why The Contempt?

    Michael's simply the easiest target. He puts himself out in front of his films, so any discussion is bound to involve him in some way or another. Most directors hide behind their films and can avoid the daggers much easier.

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    Senior Member darthrage's Avatar
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    Default Re: Why The Contempt?

    People liked him for Bad Boys and The Rock. Sure Armageddon was a little hokey but it was then when people started thinking him of making dumb action movies.

    And then came the announcement of Pearl Harbor, a movie that most people didn't want to get made and also thought Michael Bay was a bad choice. Not only did they bash him for making something so serious, feel so commercial but that is when all the hate really started happening.

    But the hate really ultimately all came down to this......the fact that he made so much success at a young age in so little time. People always feel jealous or always wanna bring down the guy at the top and honestly speaking, he's right up there with Spielberg and Cameron.

    Sam Raimi, Gore Verbinski, Peter Jackson did it with their trilogy franchises, but Bay did it with a few loud and entertaining action movies.

    The Transformers thing solidified that there was indeed hate but I think alot of the hate from TF fans as well as general audiences alike went away after seeing how successful the movie was and also in the last few weeks when there have been countless news blogs and articles stating how cool and friendly Michael Bay is when on set and what good personal relations he has with fans and spectators while on production of TF2.

    At this point, there really is not much hate on him. The people who hate him right now are only the following:

    - Hardcore Transformers fans
    - Artsy film critics
    - And people who saw one his movies and didn't like it and swore to themselves that they will never like any of his movies no matter how good they are

  8. #8

    Default Re: Why The Contempt?

    it's always been like that and always will.
    anything big, commercial etc. is "bad".
    same with the usa overall, microsoft, etc.

    plus his movie are just plain bad, STORY/CHARACTER-wise.
    the problem is the people complaining about that, just don't "get" how someone still could enjoy them for its awesome visuals etc.

    btw. "he has lots of supporters...(mtv just voted in their love for him)"
    good one..

    the funny (and sad) thing is that even uwe boll now gets more "love" since he shifted toward the "independent" guy (which is pathetic but what can you do)

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    Default Re: Why The Contempt?

    Quote Originally Posted by Simon View Post
    plus his movie are just plain bad, STORY/CHARACTER-wise.
    No, they're not...

  10. #10
    Junior Member King's Avatar
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    Default Re: Why The Contempt?

    The g1 fan thing has always struck me as unjust on so many levels, i've never understood why filmmakers change things and go against us fans of original material untill now, when i got an outside look at it...what they want will sooth their belly's and memories but it's equatable to batman wearing leotards...the worst thing is that it's grown men "fighting" for a kids show that was initially intended to sell toys...

    that's pretty much grown women wanting a barbie movies(bratz) to be sex and the city

    it's not batman

    TF was intended for them, but they seem to forget that it was when they were boys...
    assuming they weren't selfish enough to chalk up the tickets for their own kids
    i wonder if during their eye rolling experience (even though deep down they were blown away but won't admit it) they took a look at their little boys in the seat next to them

    i looked at my little cousin and his eyes were wide as hell.

    Fans say bay failed because he didn't give the "fans" the feeling they got when they were kids..

    what a sh1tty situation for bay then cause fans aren't kids anymore...(not in the ways that shoud matter anyway)

    honkey stuff that flew in the eighties wouldn't have been voted best movie buy the young generation in todays world...

    i could go on about all the things done right in TF but i'll save it for another post

    as far as critics saying he hates his audience and doesn't know them?

    if you go to any bay movie on opening night...you'll see the medium do incredible things to an audience

    like chaplin said, movies should be made for the ppl

  11. #11
    Junior Member King's Avatar
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    Default Re: Why The Contempt?

    whats more, is that whenever the mention of how stunning the movie was comes into play, it's all about ILM

    i've never seen them get to much praise...since well...the last Bay movie

    cause as "bad" as the new starwars flicks were...not transformers "bad" but "bad"
    ILM was the talk of the town in the week following...those guys save movies...

  12. #12
    Senior Member r-type's Avatar
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    Default Re: Why The Contempt?

    I always like to jokingly refer to the psychological term, Reaction Formation. (look it up)

    Thats the best way I can describe the behavior of some of these people who have a really unhealthy contempt for Bay, who continuously harp on and on about why Bay is this, why Bay is that. Or his movies.

    Or they are just trying to make a name for themselves by jumping on that hate bandwagon.

    I have nothing else to add that Ladiesman or T-Mike haven't already said, as far as the "why's" are concerned.

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    Default Re: Why The Contempt?

    Quote Originally Posted by r-type View Post
    I always like to jokingly refer to the psychological term, Reaction Formation. (look it up)
    You just had to bring up Eliot Spitzer, didn't ya... It's the Twinkie, just tell them it's the Twinkie's fault -- that's what I keep tellin' peeps.

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    Default Re: Why The Contempt?

    A, ILM is only as good as the director, hence, 79% of the CGI they create really looks like shit, especially many star wars stuff. But Bay put's those lil creative bitches in check and makes sure they dont screw him over like they do Lucas....

    All in all, some people just hate, I dont like M. Night, though I actually, strangely, adore him as an actor, I fuckin hate M. Night as a filmmaker. I dunno, thats just how it is.

    Oh, that and everybody who looks down upon Bay are tasteless dicks.
    Joking aside, most people love his art, they just hate the shitty stories he tells, like, all of them. Most people who hate Bay will tolerate and like The Rock, I find, because of the story line. Where all his other movies it's more like, WTF just happened..... Armageddon being his worst story IMHO, but his best work regardless.

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    Default Re: Why The Contempt?

    I've got my pro's and con's with Mr. Bay. I am a G1 lover for sure...and while I'm not totally satisfied with the movie (My opinion) others seem to love it. I may nit pick at many flaws or even at the way the story did nothing for the TFs characters...but then that's my right to bitch. You either enjoyed it or not. That's how I see it. It's a movie...not everyone is going to see eye to eye with the same movie.

    Take Batman (1989) for instance. I loved that dark, gritty, off beat film for everything it was....yet there are many Bat fans who feel it wasn't that great at all. They bitch about that, but care not do I....for I enjoyed the film and in the end...that's all that really matters to me.

    I wasn't "Blown away" like the mass majority about Mike's TF movie...personally I found it hollow and empty of character. But that's my gripe with the film and not how everyone else feels about it.

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    Default Re: Why The Contempt?

    Quote Originally Posted by Jetplague View Post
    Take Batman (1989) for instance. I loved that dark, gritty, off beat film for everything it was....yet there are many Bat fans who feel it wasn't that great at all. They bitch about that, but care not do I....for I enjoyed the film and in the end...that's all that really matters to me.
    A little off-topic but...

    Tim Burton, I think, hated Batman. He hated the character. He only wanted showcase his colorful, off-ball villians. This becomes VERY evident in the sequel. If you were to take a stop-watch to the film.... First of all, there's four main players and it's Keaton, Michelle Phieffer, DeVito and Chris Walken and if you timed their screentime you would probably find out Keaton, Batman himself, has the least amount of screentime of all of them, which is insane.

    You can argue that Michael didn't have any respect for the G1-series but at least he didn't reduce Optimus to a boring stiff, or didn't understand why people would care for something like Transformers in the first place. Especially now when TF made 700 million dollars at the box-office and Michael really got to see peoples love for the characters of Optimus, Bumblebee and whatnot I certainly think he's going to give us way more robot screentime in the second one.
    Last edited by LadiesMan217; 06-13-2008 at 10:46 AM.

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    Default Re: Why The Contempt?

    Quote Originally Posted by LadiesMan217 View Post
    A little off-topic but...

    Tim Burton, I think, hated Batman. He hated the character. He only wanted showcase his colorful, off-ball villians. This becomes VERY evident in the sequel. If you were to take a stop-watch to the film.... First of all, there's four main players and it's Keaton, Michelle Phieffer, DeVito and Chris Walken and if you timed their screentime you would probably find out Keaton, Batman himself, has the least amount of screentime of all of them, which is insane.

    You can argue that Michael didn't have any respect for the G1-series but at least he didn't reduce Optimus to a boring stiff, or didn't understand why people would care for something like Transformers in the first place. Especially now when TF made 700 million dollars at the box-office and Michael really got to see peoples love for the characters of Optimus, Bumblebee and whatnot I certainly think he's going to give us way more robot screentime in the second one.

    See that to me is bullshit. Batman Returns was a sequel he virtually didn't want to make in the first place, but Warner Bros. had him on contract to do so. Tim rarely makes sequels and Returns to him was probably less enjoyable to do because of the constraints that the producers had for him. The first one was perfect...the sequel was lower in budget (Hollywood having to buckle down during that time because of full scale economic crisis) But, yes...he was bored of doing Batman by then. But at least Returns was not as super-ass boring lame as Batman Forever and Batman And Robin. Burton at least gave Batman his darker image and showed that a good comic book movie could be done yet again. (Seeing how it had been sometime since a comic book film of epic scale had been seen - Superman and Superman II being the examples.)

    Optimus Prime was a boring stiff. Infact he had zero personality...a far cry from his persona in the various comics, cartoons and incarnations.

    Of course he's going to give them more screen time....sort of. Now that the "Origin" story is out of the way, it frees him up to tackle on the story from a new angle now. But humans still make up far too much of the plot and that really is ashame...because we came to see those giant fucking robots...and not those stupid primitive apes that get in the way thinking they are advanced enough to take on a "technologically superior" race of beings. The fact that humans could manage to hurt TFs in the movie with their own weaponry made me laugh in disbelief.

  18. #18
    Junior Member King's Avatar
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    Default Re: Why The Contempt?

    not sure what was so funny about it

    sabot rounds are not really .45 hollowpoints

    next ppl with think a human made nuke has no effect on an alien space craft

  19. #19
    Senior Member Mobe1969's Avatar
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    Default Re: Why The Contempt?

    Quote Originally Posted by King View Post
    Fans say bay failed because he didn't give the "fans" the feeling they got when they were kids..

    what a sh1tty situation for bay then cause fans aren't kids anymore...(not in the ways that shoud matter anyway)

    honkey stuff that flew in the eighties wouldn't have been voted best movie buy the young generation in todays world...

    i could go on about all the things done right in TF but i'll save it for another post

    as far as critics saying he hates his audience and doesn't know them?

    if you go to any bay movie on opening night...you'll see the medium do incredible things to an audience

    like chaplin said, movies should be made for the ppl
    Yeah, I'm disappointed he didn't have Megatron transform into a handgun like in the series. Be true to the stupid cartoon... (sarcasm here...)


    You are right about the 80s/youth though. When I was young and sneaking watches of horror movies as a kid/teen, I thought Wes Craven was the second coming. I see his movies from that period now and they make me cringe.


    That said I hated transformers as they were too unrealistic. The toys looked like crap and nothing like the cartoon when in robot form.

  20. #20
    Member Wicket's Avatar
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    Default Re: Why The Contempt?

    It's like this. It doesn't matter who the director is. People somewhere along the line are going to like, dislike, love, hate and not care about them. The only thing that is important is if the directors love what they do and continue to do so as long as it makes them happy. So what if people hated Armeggedon! The real question is, did Michael Bay like it?

  21. #21
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    Default Re: Why The Contempt?

    Quote Originally Posted by Jetplague View Post
    Of course he's going to give them more screen time....sort of. Now that the "Origin" story is out of the way, it frees him up to tackle on the story from a new angle now. But humans still make up far too much of the plot and that really is ashame...because we came to see those giant fucking robots...and not those stupid primitive apes that get in the way thinking they are advanced enough to take on a "technologically superior" race of beings. The fact that humans could manage to hurt TFs in the movie with their own weaponry made me laugh in disbelief.
    The humans had to be there. The non-transformers fans needed characters they could relate to and give them a way into the movie. I have no interest in the cartoon, no prior knowledge of Transformers lore. My interest in Transformers started the day it was announced Michael Bay would be directing the movie.
    "To the Believer, no proof is necessary...To the non-Believer, no proof is possible."

  22. #22
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    Default Re: Why The Contempt?

    I have no interest in the cartoon, no prior knowledge of Transformers lore. My interest in Transformers started the day it was announced Michael Bay would be directing the movie.
    WOOHOO then i'm not alone!
    My Fav Bay -
    1. The Rock
    2. Bad Boys 2
    3. Transformers
    4. Bad Boys
    5. The Island
    6. Armageddon
    7. Pearl Harbor

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