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Thread: "Why 'Pirates Of The Caribbean' And 'Transformers' May Rule Summer 2017."

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    Senior Member Bayhem's Avatar
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    Arrow "Why 'Pirates Of The Caribbean' And 'Transformers' May Rule Summer 2017."

    "Betting against the Transformers and Pirates franchises has been a losing game from the start. If we’re looking at recent history, Transformers: The Last Knight and Pirates of the Caribbean: Dead Men Tell No Tales seem to be positioned to rule the season, or at least be among the top movies next summer."


    - http://www.forbes.com/sites/scottmen.../#549cb5cf1eef
    "You know why the departures and the arrivals at LAX are on separate levels? So the 30,000 heartbreakers that come here each month don't notice the 30,000 that are leaving with their hearts broken."

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    Default Re: "Why 'Pirates Of The Caribbean' And 'Transformers' May Rule Summer 2017."

    Quote Originally Posted by Bayhem View Post
    "Betting against the Transformers and Pirates franchises has been a losing game from the start. If we’re looking at recent history, Transformers: The Last Knight and Pirates of the Caribbean: Dead Men Tell No Tales seem to be positioned to rule the season, or at least be among the top movies next summer."


    - http://www.forbes.com/sites/scottmen.../#549cb5cf1eef
    This is why I was glad that Jurassic World and Age of Extinction did not release so close together. Both were big name and were expected, and did, do very well at the box office. They both also featured dinosaurs as an over arching theme.

    No doubt next year The Last Knight will again rock the Box Office. Say what you will about Bay or how he does his movies, but there is zero doubt he usually makes bank at the box office. Which means that regardless of what his haters say, he's generally tuned in to what the people want to see. The box office numbers usually back that up.

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    Senior Member shadowinvid's Avatar
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    Default Re: "Why 'Pirates Of The Caribbean' And 'Transformers' May Rule Summer 2017."

    I think most people are over Pirates of the Caribbean. It should have stopped after the second one. It will flop. Transformers though will soar

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    Senior Member Bayhem's Avatar
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    Default Re: "Why 'Pirates Of The Caribbean' And 'Transformers' May Rule Summer 2017."

    Quote Originally Posted by shadowinvid View Post
    I think most people are over Pirates of the Caribbean. It should have stopped after the second one. It will flop.

    I doubt it'll be a flop. This is still a huge, huge franchise.

    In North America, yes, the next movie will not break any box office records. But globally the "Pirates" brand is still absolutely huge. Especially in Europe. Jack Sparrow is an extremely popular character and with the right marketing campaign I'm certain "Dead Men Tell No Tales" will hit it really big at the international box office. I'm talking $1 billion big. I'm even willing to bet that will make more money (globally) than "The Last Knight".

    It's been a few years since the previous "Pirates" movie, so the fans are definitely hungry for more Jack Sparrow.
    "You know why the departures and the arrivals at LAX are on separate levels? So the 30,000 heartbreakers that come here each month don't notice the 30,000 that are leaving with their hearts broken."

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    Senior Member i-MAN's Avatar
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    Default Re: "Why 'Pirates Of The Caribbean' And 'Transformers' May Rule Summer 2017."

    Quote Originally Posted by Bayhem View Post
    I doubt it'll be a flop. This is still a huge, huge franchise.

    In North America, yes, the next movie will not break any box office records. But globally the "Pirates" brand is still absolutely huge. Especially in Europe. Jack Sparrow is an extremely popular character and with the right marketing campaign I'm certain "Dead Men Tell No Tales" will hit it really big at the international box office. I'm talking $1 billion big. I'm even willing to bet that will make more money (globally) than "The Last Knight".

    It's been a few years since the previous "Pirates" movie, so the fans are definitely hungry for more Jack Sparrow.
    Not a "pirates " fan.
    I never make it to the end. Boring !
    There once was a tale about a man who can turn invisible.....

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    Senior Member Flyingheart's Avatar
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    Thumbs up Re: "Why 'Pirates Of The Caribbean' And 'Transformers' May Rule Summer 2017."

    I liked the Pirates with Penélope Cruz in it... you can guess why i liked it lol
    But seriously though, they were fun to watch i think i watch em all one way or another.

    May Transformers 5 be a great succes! *lifts up beer*
    When i Transform i release rockets with nanobot-viruses that destroys you from within... the fuel inside you will turn into acid, metal will melt instantly...
    I'm a decepticon and my name is _____ All Hail Megatron!

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    Senior Member Bayhem's Avatar
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    Default Re: "Why 'Pirates Of The Caribbean' And 'Transformers' May Rule Summer 2017."

    "How 'Pirates Of The Caribbean,' 'Transformers' Became Best-Case Scenarios For Hollywood Adaptations"

    "While "Pirates of the Caribbean: Curse of the Black Pearl" was initially based on a theme park ride and "Transformers" was based on a series of action figures that were popularized by an afternoon cartoon show, both cinematic series have arguably surpassed the source material in terms of popularity and general awareness."


    Interesting read - https://www.forbes.com/sites/scottme.../#52d349394f13
    "You know why the departures and the arrivals at LAX are on separate levels? So the 30,000 heartbreakers that come here each month don't notice the 30,000 that are leaving with their hearts broken."

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    Senior Member Gabriel's Avatar
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    Default Re: "Why 'Pirates Of The Caribbean' And 'Transformers' May Rule Summer 2017."

    Bart & Fleming: ‘The Mummy’s Franchise Fail & 21st Century’s Top Films So Far
    Quote Originally Posted by Peter Bart and Mike Fleming Jr.


    FLEMING: What is the long-term takeaway of the failure of Pirates Of The Caribbean and now The Mummy to incite any excitement among moviegoers, Peter? Maybe we need to wait for the next Transformers to be sure, but I would say that these committee-formulated summer studio franchises are facing what many felt was inevitable: they are hitting the wall, hard. So is the star system. Remember when a superstar’s presence could guarantee a big U.S. opening weekend?


    BART: In “studio speak,” franchises are out and universes are in, in terms of production initiatives. Yet it’s hard to remember a moment when an initiative has met with as much skepticism as Universal’s Dark Universe line of genre movies (already dubbed “dim universe” by the New York Times). And the critical drubbing accorded The Mummy has turned up the noise.


    FLEMING: Universal Pictures must have felt like its charmed franchise run would continue forever, with The Mummy sandwiched between the $1.2 billion-grossing The Fate Of The Furious and the upcoming Despicable Me 3. But this Mummy felt as stale as the lining of a sarcophagus; it had to be the studio’s most disappointing attempted franchise launch since Battleship. The stakes here are enormous for the studio. Universal signed big established stars for classic movie monster resuscitating, from Frankenstein to Bride Of Frankenstein, Dracula, Wolf Man, Dr Jekyll And Mr. Hyde, The Invisible Man and The Creature From The Black Lagoon. I have never understood the enthusiasm, even when Guillermo del Toro explained it to me when he was entrusted with many of those properties. He said the classic literature origins were so indelible that there was plenty a filmmaker could to do to engage today’s audiences. To me, they all seem like slow-moving, dust-covered B&W relics locked in an era that has no relevance. I quite liked the last Mummy iteration, the playful Stephen Sommers-Brendan Fraser-Rachel Weisz films that spawned a theme park ride and launched Dwayne Johnson (who is now mentioned as a potential Wolf Man). Those Mummy movies borrowed the Indiana Jones romance model. What did the new Alex Kurtzman-directed iteration have, besides a game Tom Cruise? They could have made it scary, with a terrifying villain and ominous mummy henchmen. But it wasn’t that, at all. It wasn’t really a romance, either: we’re told early that Cruise’s character spent a night with Annabelle Wallis’s archaeologist and pissed her off by stealing a map. There were no onscreen sparks between them. Kurtzman could have made Sofia Boutella’s title character an exotic Cleopatra-like seductress — Boutella is capable of that, as evidenced by the Atomic Blonde trailer and her performances in Kingsmen and even last summer’s Star Trek. Then you could have understood why Cruise’s character would fall under her spell and why a future of immortality with her would be appealing. Instead, they made her an annoying, decaying, half-formed mess with tattooed symbols that made her look like the wife of the lead character in Memento. That left us with a bunch of pricey set pieces that could not compensate for the lack of real characters or tension or genuine scares. This launch of the Monsters line goes down as disappointing even if it covers its costs overseas the way that DC’s Batman V Superman did. Universal still has to convince us that, in an era where audiences are scared by terrific grounded fright films like Get Out, Split and Don’t Breathe or TV shows like The Walking Dead, that these monsters old enough to be public domain literary properties do likewise.


    BART: I thought The Mummy was on its way to being an entertaining horror picture in its first hour. Then I could hear the studio shouting, ‘we have Tom Cruise; ‘let’s up the budget and the pyrotechnics.’ At that point, the movie began to spin out of control. It’s a mess. And it does not auger well for Universal’s future line-up of star-laden horror films like Bride of Frankenstein or The Invisible Man (Johnny Depp will be invisible).


    FLEMING: Is it possible to breathe life into these musty old monsters? Even though the lack of humor and subtlety in his DC movies like Batman V Superman troubled me, Zack Snyder launched his career with a remake of Dawn of the Dead. Going in, I wondered: how can you make George Romero’s slow moving corpses seem menacing? The movie opened with Sarah Polley running from a zombie that just killed her husband. This corpse chased her like Usain Bolt running the 100 yard dash. That put me on the edge of my chair. Universal execs have done an exceptional job casting its Monster Universe: Javier Bardem for Frankenstein, Depp for Invisible Man, maybe Angelina Jolie for Bride of Frankenstein and possibly crying wolf with Johnson. But the formulaic pollination we see with Marvel and DC films won’t work here. Each of these movies better be scary as hell, or bear some stylistic genre signature all their own. If they are going to follow with Russell Crowe’s Doctor Jekyll (he debuted the character in The Mummy), use that actor’s estimable gifts of intensity and intimidation and physicality to make him the most terrifying sociopath since Hannibal Lecter. That would mean a better-drawn character than I saw last weekend, where Jekyll’s Hyde persona could be eradicated like the measles, with an inoculation.


    BART: I’d go back to the drawing board and trace the problems of The Mummy. Let’s begin with the cast and the question: Do horror pictures need movie stars, or vice versa? Tom Cruise has been a star for almost forty years and I agree with Joe Morgenstern of The Wall St Journal that this is his worst role, spending most of the movie “getting beat up by an infestation of digital mummies.” Nor does the movie need him or Crowe, intoning pseudo-scientific nonsense as Dr. Jekyll (characters are tossed in just to set up further movies).


    FLEMING: They might not be worthy of first dollar gross deals, but I like seeing stars. I enjoyed Crowe in The Nice Guys and like seeing him lend his commanding presence to populist fare like this, and I have been a fan of Cruise since Risky Business. The Mummy has prompted cynics to declare that Cruise is over. He isn’t, of course but the star system is, save for maybe Denzel Washington and Leonardo DiCaprio. Maybe it’s their careful selection process that has made them exceptions: Washington’s making his first ever sequel, The Equalizer. Like John Wick and Sicario, The Equalizer was a one-off that left audiences wanting more, which was how franchises like Die Hard and The Terminator got built. DiCaprio’s eyeing his own serial killer turn, but his will be the real life ghoulish doctor who terrorized the Chicago World’s Fair, with Martin Scorsese likely directing The Devil in the White City. There is no franchise there, but that seems more interesting to me than the umpteenth incarnation of Dr Jekyll.


    I’m not sure why Cruise felt he needed another franchise, with Mission: Impossible in good standing, and I’m not sure what this means for a Top Gun sequel more than three decades after a hit that bore Tony Scott’s stylistic directorial imprint and came during the gung-ho Ronald Reagan presidency. Are global audiences going to line up for an homage to macho U.S. military might when Donald Trump is alienating both allies and enemies on Twitter, or will they have to minimize the Red White and Blue as was done with Wonder Woman? Cruise is still the longest running superstar act in Hollywood, and I know he likes barnstorming the world to promote his big movies. I recall him telling me that, growing up poor, he dreamed of visiting the countries he saw in movies, and petitioned studios to let him travel abroad doing press tours, so he could see these places. Believe it or not, he said studios fought him at first, when the priority was domestic receipts and video, and not foreign. His curiosity birthed the template of stars globally promoting their films, and he has never stopped tirelessly promoting his films like that. He made a mistake here, I think. But The Mummy was preceded by a trailer for American Made, the fact based drama where Cruise plays a pilot who flew drugs and weapons for the CIA and found himself up to his eyeballs with the likes of Manuel Noriego and Pablo Escobar, and all the danger that implies. That’s a Tom Cruise movie I want to see.


    BART: At 54, Cruise faces issues similar to those of Brad Pitt and George Clooney, but he’s not handling them as well, committing himself to junk genres while his confreres are tackling quality projects. I miss the Cruise of Jerry Maguire and Rain Man and even Tropic Thunder. As for the studios, they’re not helping. Warner Bros is re-inventing its DC Universe and Sony its The Dark Tower universe based on Stephen King novels. But they’re all about high concepts, not character concepts; movie stars would do well to forage elsewhere in the intellectual property universe to keep their careers alive.


    FLEMING: You are wrong, I hope, on The Dark Tower; excepting the Magnificent Seven remake and Blazing Saddles, how often do you see a Western franchise anchored by a black actor playing the lead gunslinger? This could be a breath of fresh air this summer. You always knock Clooney in these columns, but bringing him up allows me to establish the difference in this discussion. Clooney stopped chasing franchises after his Batman foray. Whether his movies work or not, his motives are purer and it has led to a great career not about making the most money possible. He empowered Gravity when it teetered after Robert Downey Jr dropped out and other male stars didn’t want to spend 15 minutes of screen time propping up Sandra Bullock. There is Syriana, Michael Clayton and Good Night and Good Luck. Clooney misfired in Tomorrowland, but you can’t fault an actor for buying into the vision of a great director like Brad Bird, much as you can’t fault Idris Elba’s The Dark Tower costar Matthew McConaughey for doing the same on Christopher Nolan’s Interstellar.


    BART: You leaped so quickly to George’s defense that I wonder what gift you sent for his newborn twins. What I was trying to do is illustrate a Cruise conundrum: other male stars like Clooney, Pitt and Washington are aging and becoming more interesting to watch. Cruise looks the same as he did 20 or 30 years ago.


    FLEMING: When we talk about actors setting up franchises they don’t really need, I’ll be curious to see how Downey and Stephen Gaghan do with Dr. Dolittle. I guess the idea is to replace Iron Man, but to me it’s another idea that feels like a head scratcher because it has been again and again. Meanwhile, I just saw Baby Driver, this Edgar Wright-directed heist picture. After seeing Pirates and The Mummy, I was struck by the exhilaration of sitting in a theater, watching a well told story with distinctive characters and visual style and not knowing where it was all going. Kevin Spacey, Jon Hamm and Jamie Foxx playing deliciously awful people around this adorable getaway driver played by The Fault In Our Stars‘ Ansel Elgort. I hate to see studios lose money, but maybe they need to be reminded that sequels aren’t like Amazon stock certificates.


    BART: I felt the same way, seeing The Big Sick.


    FLEMING: People want to be surprised. The people at Universal are smart and I’m sure they’ll figure out how to hone the monster formula they’re so invested in, as Warner Bros brass did with Wonder Woman.


    BART: In terms of movie archaeology, The Mummy became an instant ruin not only because of the critics but also because of Wonder Woman, which is a lot more fun to experience and which opened to $220 million worldwide (it held up well in its second weekend). Patty Jenkins won high plaudits for directing her super-heroine – ironically her first hit was titled Monster, starring Charlize Theron, but Jenkins was smart enough to steer clear of further monster movies.


    FLEMING: My takeaway there is how unpredictable the movie business is, and how satisfying when things fall into place. After Jenkins guided Theron to her Best Actress Oscar playing the serial killer drama in Monster, how could it possibly have taken 14 years for her to get another movie to direct? You’d think another actor would say, I want an Oscar, too; get her! Jenkins only got Wonder Woman after another director dropped out, and boy did Warner Bros get lucky. I’ve heard she and Geoff Johns are working right now on a sequel take that they’ll likely bring to screenwriter Allan Heinberg to turn into a script. Jenkins has to make a deal, but you can bet it won’t take another 14 years for her to make another movie. This is a great Hollywood story, but it doesn’t adhere to any formula other than you gotta remember to tell a good story with characters you care about. Wonder Woman did that, and The Mummy did not.


    BART: While I appreciate Wonder Woman’s qualities as entertainment, I am perplexed by the adulatory press response to the movie. Its opening triggered an almost Trump-ian tweet-storm – the most tweeted movie of the year. Meredith Woerner wrote in the Los Angeles Times that the “sight of female warriors kicking ass” was so empowering that she started to cry. Jenkins was hailed for “saving the DC universe.” In interviews, Jenkins said that, as a woman, she felt free to make Wonder Woman “vulnerable, loving and warm,” suggesting that male-directed superheroes have been downright chilly. Actress Gal Gadot, her star, also has found a loving press. “Daughter of Israel is a source of wonder,” headlined the Los Angeles Times. As a result, Wonder Woman has attracted more women than male ticket buyers – remarkable for superhero movies. Several pieces about the film predicted that it may empower many women to ask for a raise at work (the two ‘heavies’ in Wonder Women are older grey-haired guys who look like the typical workplace bosses). Still, Wonder Woman is a comic book character; perhaps Marissa Mayer’s $900,000 a week pay check during her years at Yahoo would provide more practical inspiration.


    FLEMING: You could see signs of this when girls of every shape and size at last San Diego Comic-Con wore Wonder Woman outfits. I’m sure Jenkins did bring touches that a male director would have overlooked. Women have been waiting for an opportunity like this, and now we’ll see more because the movie is a hit. The Walking Dead samurai sword-swinging heroine Dania Gurira is expanding her badass warrior character from Black Panther to Avengers: Infinity War; and maybe this will goose to the start line another Mad Max that brings back Theron’s Furiosa character. I hope we see a version of this when Black Panther births the first freestanding black superhero movie character since Wesley Snipes in Blade, and that The Dark Tower also works with Elba in the lead. It’s important for studios to see rewards for thinking outside the box.

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    Senior Member Gabriel's Avatar
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    Default Re: "Why 'Pirates Of The Caribbean' And 'Transformers' May Rule Summer 2017."

    COLLIDER JUNE 24, 2017:
    Friday Box Office: ‘Transformers: The Last Knight’ Leads Pack Despite Franchise-Low Domestic Opening
    Quote Originally Posted by CHRIS CABIN
    With the release of Transformers: The Last Knight, we are supposedly seeing the release of the final film in the franchise to be directed by Michael Bay, the pale king of modern empty-headed movie spectacles. It’s also easily the most idiotic film in the series, and runs at an unmerciful two-and-a-half hours, which is shorter than Age of Extinction but in the same realm as Dark of the Moon. I don’t imagine that these are the reasons that The Last Knight is currently looking at an estimated $62 million opening weekend, which would be the most meager opening for the franchise to date, but there is something to be said for an audience simply losing interest in franchise, even after sticking it through four films that in total are about the length of the entire last season of Fargo.


    There is a silver lining here, however, and it speaks to the growing reliance on foreign box office prospects over domestic ones. In China, The Last Knight has already amassed $41 million on its opening day, which is well over half of what Bay’s movie is projected to make over five days in the states. This is good news for Bay and Paramount, but probably not great news for American audiences who are becoming more easily fatigued by franchises. If a movie as extravagantly stupid and unspeakably convoluted as The Last Knight can make back its frankly outrageous budget via the foreign box office, there will be a shift to promote more abroad and continue to release these empty and astoundingly expensive entertainments rather than try something vaguely new to capture the American audience. The foreign BO, for better or (mostly) worse, is now becoming the savior of the American movie studios unoriginal, risk-averse production schedule more than ever.

    Deadline June 24, 2017:
    ‘Transformers: The Last Knight’ Rises To $93M In China – International Box Office
    Quote Originally Posted by Nancy Tartaglione
    Contrary to domestic, Paramount’s Transformers: The Last Knight is on track to top the opening of Transformers: Age Of Extinction at the international box office. Although the studio is not providing an update today, as Friday estimates came in late yesterday (see below), the unofficial Saturday in China puts the Michael Bay pic at about $93M there so far.


    That sets it up for an FSS Middle Kingdom bow of around $130M (including previews). Elsewhere, it should add on roughly another $50M through today and tomorrow to bring the total in 41 markets to the $220M neighborhood. These are not official numbers, but based on the earlier play, are a reasonable ballpark.


    In 2014, Age Of Extinction opened to $183M in like-for-like markets and at today’s exchange rates. That film had topped Transformers: Dark Of The Moon by 35% at launch. China, as well as general overseas growth, accounted in part for the increased performance.


    Domestically, The Last Knight is on track to take in about $40M+ for the three-day and is looking at a $63.9M five-day, which would be the lowest opening in the series of five films, per my colleague Anthony D’Alessandro.


    With regard to China, some industry sources saw it coming in much lower ahead of the weekend, but it is stomping on screens — almost 167K showings today, per Ent Group, as compared to just 11K for the No. 2 title, Alien: Covenant. Age Of Extinction opened to $92M in China in 2014 and there has been considerable growth in the market since.


    T5 has a 4.9 score on reviews site Douban compared to Age Of Extinction‘s 6.6; audiences are giving it a 7.4 on ticketing site Maoyan while Age Of Extinction was at 7. Hollywood tentpoles lean towards a 2-2.2 multiple in the PROC, which would see Last Knight fall below TAOE‘s final tally in non-restated dollars. The last pic made $320M there — although local currency will ultimately be seen as the measure. Last Knight has some runway with no major studio movie hitting the market until Despicable Me 3 on July 5.


    China, Korea, Russia and some smaller South East Asia hubs led the Friday play. We’ll have a full update and analysis tomorrow which will provide clearer optics on Optimus and the gang’s first weekend out with Last Knight.

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