Shia LaBeouf Out of TF4. Ehren Kruger is Writing.

[Albershide]

DreamWorks President of Production Adam Goodman made only a two sentence update on TF4 but it was enough to shed some light on two of the more important aspects of the movie - Story and Male Lead.

THR: Is making Transformers 4 without Shia LaBeouf risky? Is he out?

Goodman: The story is going in a different direction now. Ehren Kruger [who wrote the past two Transformers movies] is writing it for us, and we're starting to engage, but I can't say anything more.

Honestly I'm happy that we'll get a fresh cast and I was really hoping that they would change the writer too. After all that's the easiest way if you want to go in a different direction. And don't get me wrong I love Shia (his performance in the 2007 movie was outstanding) and Ehren, just wanted to see a different take on the story.

http://www.hollywoodreporter.com/new...labeouf-315801

[sora]

Looking forward to Ehren's new take on the direction. Hope to see even more thick/emotional storyline and plot twists.

[starscream1017]

yeah i wanted new cast and new writers as well.. dotm looked amazing, but story was lame, we have seen it before. this guy is also writing for spiderman 2.

[i-MAN]

Call me a shia fan, personal let down for me. i Will get over it.
Not happy with the writer, agreed dotm was boring.
New fresh blood is needed in the writers department

[Albershide]

this guy is also writing for spiderman 2.

Roberto Orci and Alex Kurtzman (TF 2007, ROTF) are writing Spiderman 2 not Ehren Kruger (ROTF, DOTM). I think Ehren is a great writer. I love Arlington Road, The Ring and The Skeleton Key. Very clever stories but a change is always welcome.

Call me a shia fan, personal let down for me.

I recently watched TF 2007 and I think Shia's performance there is award winning. I can't imagine the first movie without him. Still I think his performance degraded in the sequels and the change was needed especially for him.

[Bayhem]

A lot of "love" on this thread, huh?

I'm curious, what kind of story do you folks want in a "Transformers" movie? What kind of "script" do you expect? I've seen a lot of complaints about the script and the story in all three films...and no one actually said what was so "bad" about them. And no, it's not the humor. The humor is part of the script, it's not the entire script.


It's hilarious how many people complain about the story and the script of the "Transformers" films, yet no one says anything about the script or the story of...for example, "The Expendables". The defense is that "The Expendables" is an action movie where badass action stars kick butt. And no one cares about the story or the script.

Well, correct me if I'm wrong, but last time I checked the "Transformers" films are also action films and they certainly don't pretend to be more than that. So why the double standard? Why "The Expendables" gets a pass and "Transformers" is constantly criticized in that area? And most importantly, why the "script critics" demand so much from the story, while at the same time they keep saying that "Transformers" is just about giant action and giant robots beating the crap out of each other? Make up your minds, folks.


So...if someone can actually explain that "double standard" to me, I'd be grateful.


P.S. In my view, Kruger did a good job in "Dark of the Moon". The story was engaging enough and I liked the twist with Sentinel. If that means that I have a bad taste, then so be it.

[Xsubs]

Well, correct me if I'm wrong, but last time I checked the "Transformers" films are also action films and they certainly don't pretend to be more than that. So why the double standard? Why "The Expendables" gets a pass and "Transformers" is constantly criticized in that area? And most importantly, why the "script critics" demand so much from the story, while at the same time they keep saying that "Transformers" is just about giant action and giant robots beating the crap out of each other? Make up your minds, folks.

Considering transformers is a well established franchise, surely people have high expectations for a live action movie; and that means a good balance of story, good action and good character development.
The expectation for expendables was just action (as you would expect from a movie filled with just action movie stars.)

A movie is pointless if its just action. Incorporating some sort of theme to TF would be good.

[Bayhem]

Considering transformers is a well established franchise, surely people have high expectations for a live action movie; and that means a good balance of story, good action and good character development.

We have to keep in mind that this is a franchise based on toys and cartoons. It's not as dark and realistic as "Batman" so let's not take it so seriously. Also, it's a franchise of summer movies - movies that are made to entertain first and foremost the ordinary viewer. And so far I haven't heard an ordinary viewer screaming after a screening: "Along with the action I wanted to see good character development and a good script in "Dark of the Moon". I didn't get that and that's why this movie sucks!"

The expectation for expendables was just action (as you would expect from a movie filled with just action movie stars.)

And what are the expectations for a movie called "Transformers"? A movie that relies heavily on action, CGI and giant transforming metal things destroying everything. I think the expectations are exactly the same - people (or at least most people) want good action sequences, story that's easy to follow, humor and cool characters. When it comes to summer blockbuster films, that's all that I, personally, need.

A movie is pointless if its just action.

There's no such thing as a movie with nothing but action. Every movie has a plot and it's up to the individual to decide whether it's a good plot or not. Look at "Predator" for example. It's non-stop action and the human characters are absolutely typical military tough guys. Do you see deep character development in that film? Or "awesome" plot?

The answer is no. It's all pretty simple and easy to follow. But that doesn't mean that the movie is worthless.


It's pretty much the same with "Transformers". And think about it - why are they keeping Kruger as a screenwriter? If he sucks at his job, why are Bay and Spielberg still relying on him?


In this case, "more than meets the eye" comes to mind. If you know what I mean...

[Universal Kalle]

Spider-Man 2? That was released years ago and neither Kruger, Kurtzman or Orci are credited for the script. Or are you hipsters calling the reboot Spider-Man 2? Or are they already talking The Amazing Spider-Man 2, even before the first has been released?

I think the scripts for all three movies were good, with the first being the best and RotF the worst. Sure there were a few plotholes here and there and some things just didn't make any sense but overall I think they were good.

For TF4 I'd like something smaller. Something about discovery. Unveiling the origins of the Allspark or something else in ancient Cybertronian history. In short I'd like more mythos. What makes the Cybertronians tick? We touched very very briefly on that in the first movie with "self-regenerating molecular based armour". Back when Brawl just wouldn't die. He took a hell of a beating but a minute later he was back in the fight. I want more of that. In the later movies they're just to easy to kill. And explore what Energon is and how they replenish it, as they're bound to be running low about now.
What I don't want is for the end to be another fight for the future of Earth, we've had three of those already. Possibly lead up to a huge-ass all hands on deck battle of all battles in TF6.

[Universal Kalle]

We have to keep in mind that this is a franchise based on toys and cartoons. It's not as dark and realistic as "Batman" so let's not take it so seriously.

Go read the old comics penned by Simon Furman. After the cartoon stopped airing the comics turned pretty dark, mature and at times bloody brutal. And in this readers humble opinion they were fracking amazing in depth and character development.

[Bayhem]

After the cartoon stopped airing the comics turned pretty dark, mature and at times bloody brutal. And in this readers humble opinion they were fracking amazing in depth and character development.

The live-action movies, are they based on these comics? Did Bay mention that he's inspired by these comics?

No, I don't think so. The tone of that franchise is already established and it's clearly working. By the way, not every movie needs to be dark and gritty in order to be "cool".

[Universal Kalle]

Are the live-action movies based on these comics? Did Bay mention that he's inspired by these comics?

No, I don't think so. The tone of that franchise is already established and it's clearly working. By the way, not every movie needs to be dark and gritty in order to be "cool".

No one said everything needs to be dark. I was mearly pointing out that the comics weren't happy-fun-time-for-the-little-kiddies so they could whine at their parents for a new toy. Considering that The Fallen never appeared in the cartoon and was invented pretty recently in the comics, I'd say Mr Bay and Co are looking at those.

[swishbig]

I'm happy that there is going to be a new cast but to be honest, I am disappointed that Ehren is returning as the writer. Not saying that I don't like his work I just thought it would be reasonable to get someone new to write the story this time around.

[Mr.Gabba]

I thought Kruger did a good job on DOTM. I think it's the most solid and "Transformery" (is that a word?) of the three films.

Also, I believe that these movies are "based on Habro's Transformers toys". Not just G1 but off of all incarnations I would believe. So it's going to be very hard to please all Transformers fans especially if one's more a fan of the comics or Beast Wars or the g1 cartoon, or even just a follower of the toy tech specs.

All they can do is to try their best. And maybe this new direction will be a more "character" driven direction.

[MitP]

Ehren Kruger is clearly a TF fan. (G1 nerds will notice all sorts of plot elements from the original cartoon woven into DARK OF THE MOON.)

Personally, I'm keeping my fingers crossed he'll incorporate Unicron and/or Grimlock into the story this time. I just don't see how Michael could sign off from the franchise on a bigger note than using Unicron himself as the final villain.

[Albershide]

Spider-Man 2? That was released years ago and neither Kruger, Kurtzman or Orci are credited for the script. Or are you hipsters calling the reboot Spider-Man 2? Or are they already talking The Amazing Spider-Man 2, even before the first has been released?

Yeah, we're talking about The Amazing Spider-Man 2:

http://www.cinemablend.com/new/Amazi...ipt-30594.html


On topic:
I think the stories of the 3 TF movies are pretty solid for such type of movie. But there is a certain pattern that has been repeated in all three movies. I want that to change.

[starscream1017]

i just want a story that i have not seen before.. thats it. a new story..

cybertron coming to earth has been done before.. twice that i have seen- in G1 and Animated.. maybe more- i havn't seen the japanese stuff.. which is why i found the story boring..

as long as he comes up with something original.. im fine with it.

[eagc7]

As the guy knows alot of the mythology i have faith in him, but just bring back Megatron

[Honeykitt]

Glad to hear that Ehren Kruger is involved in the writing of the script. And honestly I'm glad Shia is not coming back. Although he had some good moments in the films I mostly found him and his character annoying.

[Bot of Badassness]

Ok, I didn't want Kruger to return, but since he is, I think it would still be a good idea for him to have a partner to write alongside him, to help keep the writing a little more fresh.

[saberrider]

Its a big mistake to bring back Ehren Kruger as a writer for TF4,don't everyone notice that the story and fight scene are mess since this poor writer join the franchise in TF2 & TF3,his idea is really poor and no imagination at all,we need a solid script like TF1, or maybe find someone talented etc like James Cameron to write the script,we need powerful villain and not the lousy Decepticons Protoform Soldier!!!Please note this seriously..I beg you Michael Bay, cause you are the greatest action director in the world right now,just don't ruin it with Ehren Kruger Script,I rather you find the writer who wrote "The rock" & "Bad Boys 2"...

[Matthew62]

Tf4 could be humans make a space shuttle using tf technology to find other planets with life now finding the planet its unicron disguised with many of the cool unseen decepticons ,relizing from video footage they are building an army, optimus and the other bots search the galaxy for other autobots to kill all the other guys. Now bring in the rest of the wreckers dinobots and make 1.5 billion $ because of all the awesome action

[almostthethird15]

---

Right now its just to the point of, just let the dang Transformers talk more, and the movie will automatically be that much better. like, its not hard. its not like its an "easier said than done" kind of thing. No... its a, just freaking do it and stop beating around the bush, kind of thing. nothing hard about it.

Why was TF1 so much better? It was better because the bots were treated as actual characters. Once they showed up, the humans and them were in it together. Their personalities were fleshed out. The bots were shone as lovable characters, the whole scene with them in Sam's backyard was heartwarming. We learned about them, got to know them, and when we saw em in action it was just that much greater.

Cut to RoTF, and DoTM. The bots are backgrounds. any talking from them, which is incredibly minimal, is always serious bad ass talk. where did that friendship go that we experienced in TF1 between the bots and humans go? Humans talk amongst themselves, and the bots talk amongst themselves. i dont see any normal conversations between the two other than combat related stuff. Simply, the heart is gone. The bots are weapons of destruction and nothing more in these films.

Im glad Sams gone. Good, nothing left for him to do. He was getting more and more loud and obnoxious as the films progressed. As for the writer, i really hope him and bay listen to us. humans are fine, but it has to at least be balanced as we saw in TF1. i dont know, if they would just focus on the bots a bit more, things would be so much better. Transformers 2 and 3 feel like two completely different movies. 75% being humans and their troubles, other 25% being the humans and their "transformers troubles" with the bots standing in the back.

[Crainy]

First of all, I always freaking cringe when people say stuff like "story" or something like that. Its the first indication that the one talking has no idea what hes talking about.

Both TF1 and DOTM had great scripts, expecially outstanding for action movies. They conveyed alot of emotions and brought across themes that other movies wouldnt dare to get across, even though most people dont notice these themes, either because they are focused too much on hating or are just too much in awe because of the absolutely stunning presentation. Additionally to that, these themes are very subtle, but once you notice them, you cant deny that they are present and bound to these movies very cores.

However, with that said, I do also want a new take on the Transformers franchise. We dont need another Transformers full-scale action movie. We had that 3 times already and to be honest, its getting repetitive. Have something different, have the Transformers talk more instead of fight. Have them battle out things in words instead with their fists. Instead of focusing on the fights more and more, focus on the more wonderous aspects of the Transformers that were already touched upon in the other 3 movies.

Oh, and im a big Shia fan too and loved him in all 3 movies, but I still like it that hes gone.

[Bot of Badassness]

Have something different, have the Transformers talk more instead of fight. Have them battle out things in words instead with their fists.

Remember, it will still be a Bay film, but I don agree with you. I really liked how there was no action (save Chernobyl) in the first hour of DOTM, it made the Highway Battle that much more exciting when it came along. I'll be happy if that is done again.

And of coarse, there will be a climax around 30 minutes long, which is where Bay can put most of his action focus.