Avoiding POTC4 Syndrome with TF4

**MitP** · 03-03-2012, 11:10 AM

All right...so PIRATES OF THE CARIBBEAN: ON STRANGER TIDES (the fourth chapter of another blockbuster franchise) did boffo business at the box office, and realistically speaking, that's all the suits care about in the end. I'm not completely naive - everybody knows that's how the industry has to work. But there's no denying the film doesn't hold up on repeat viewings - at least, not for a lot of people. It feels incredibly bored and tired, as if everyone involved was just going through the motions.

I like to believe that won't be the case with TF4. I know Michael agreed to take on TRANSFORMERS again as part of a two-picture deal, but I hope there were other factors that enticed him back as well. I'm only voicing these concerns because I don't think anyone wants TF4 to follow the same route as KINGDOM OF THE CRYSTAL SKULL and ON STRANGER TIDES. (All the more reason why it's a good idea for Michael to shoot P&G first, to prevent creative burnout.)

I guess what I'm saying is, when Michael starts TF4, I hope he'll be just as enthusiastic and dedicated as ever.

**sora** · 03-03-2012, 02:18 PM

Though I believe without a doubt he's always sincere and enthusiastic about his job, I too hope he'll have fun shooting TF4 as much as he does P&G.

**Albershide** · 03-03-2012, 02:45 PM

Let's not forget that POTC4 had a different director from the first 3 movies. This was it's biggest problem. It's really hard to fit in someone else's shoes.

**almostthethird15** · 03-03-2012, 03:22 PM

i like to think that because he is getting the time to do another film, he is going to return to the franchise stronger than ever. thats how i look at it.

**Trailbreaker** · 03-03-2012, 03:57 PM

Originally Posted by Albershide

Let's not forget that POTC4 had a different director from the first 3 movies. This was it's biggest problem. It's really hard to fit in someone else's shoes.

But Spielberg did direct Crystal Skull. Then again, the aliens, or "inter-dimensional beings," were George Lucas's idea. (Not some anti-Lucas thing I made up. It's on the DVD's special features. Spielberg was originally against it.)

I don't think a different director was Pirate's 4's problem. I think the real problem was the lack of other characters like Elizabeth and Will (they were actually meant to be the focus of the plot in the trilogy), and the rest of the Black Pearl crew we were all used to. The film felt a bit...empty without them.

And so we face the same challenge with TF4, whether or not the general audience will accept a Transformers film without Megatron and/or the Decepticons, Shia, and others.

**Ed Fuego** · 03-03-2012, 04:26 PM

I think it will definitely be a challenge without the known quantities of the cast from the first three, but it also gives the writers and Bay an opportunity to do something very different, which I hope they do. I think given where the last movie left the "world", I think there are a number of storylines that could be very cool (and these are just the ones in my head... that I may or may not have "developed").

Crystal Skull was not a very good movie, although I found at least some of the scenes to be enjoyable and worthy of Indiana Jones. The probably really wasn't with Spielberg's direction; it was the writing. It was just too hokey and didn't make much sense. I personally though they needed to stick with the religious themes; Spielberg has a good handle on how to depict those. And I think Lucas was the weak link. Actually, even a story about aliens could have been written into a great story, but I think Lucas has lost his mojo (although I'm not sure how much influence David Koepp had; he's had some hits and misses over the years).

Haven't seen Pirates 4 yet. I was excited to see Capain Jack again but just never got around to it.

I'm looking forward to TF4, but I really hope they create a really, really, really, really, solid script. TF1 was decent, ROTF was flawed, and DOTM was decent. But with this 4th movie, I think the filmmakers could really transition this from a "total" kids movie to something a little bit more mature (and by that I don't mean violence or language, I mean ideawise). The kids who started with TF1 will be older, able to handle it. And I think there are some really great sci-fi/conspiracy/transformery ideas that could be brought to it.

Ed Fuego

Originally Posted by Trailbreaker

But Spielberg did direct Crystal Skull. Then again, the aliens, or "inter-dimensional beings," were George Lucas's idea. (Not some anti-Lucas thing I made up. It's on the DVD's special features. Spielberg was originally against it.)

I don't think a different director was Pirate's 4's problem. I think the real problem was the lack of other characters like Elizabeth and Will (they were actually meant to be the focus of the plot in the trilogy), and the rest of the Black Pearl crew we were all used to. The film felt a bit...empty without them.

And so we face the same challenge with TF4, whether or not the general audience will accept a Transformers film without Megatron and/or the Decepticons, Shia, and others.

**Trailbreaker** · 03-03-2012, 05:40 PM

Originally Posted by Ed Fuego

Crystal Skull was not a very good movie, although I found at least some of the scenes to be enjoyable and worthy of Indiana Jones. The probably really wasn't with Spielberg's direction; it was the writing. It was just too hokey and didn't make much sense. I personally though they needed to stick with the religious themes; Spielberg has a good handle on how to depict those. And I think Lucas was the weak link. Actually, even a story about aliens could have been written into a great story, but I think Lucas has lost his mojo (although I'm not sure how much influence David Koepp had; he's had some hits and misses over the years).

Haven't seen Pirates 4 yet. I was excited to see Capain Jack again but just never got around to it.

I personally don't think that Crystal Skull is a bad film. In my view, the internet community likes to paint it as an absolute train wreck when it really isn't that bad. Yeah, it had problems, but I had a lot of fun watching it. (Yes, I even liked the "nuke the fridge" scene.) It wasn't until the end when I said to myself "oh....no they didn't."

Pirates 4 is actually a pretty good movie by itself. I guess my real issue with it is that it came after a massively huge battle of epic proportions from the last movie. My thoughts were, "okay so the other actors aren't in it, can I have a massive special FX-y moment to make up for it, please?" I didn't get that. Oh well, maybe in Pirates 5.

TF4 falls under the same situation. Just like Pirates 4, it follows a massively huge battle of epic proportions in the last movie. I just hope Mike will top himself once again with TF4.

**Ed Fuego** · 03-03-2012, 05:45 PM

Originally Posted by Trailbreaker

I personally don't think that Crystal Skull is a bad film. In my view, the internet community likes to paint it as an absolute train wreck when it really isn't that bad. Yeah, it had problems, but I had a lot of fun watching it. (Yes, I even liked the "nuke the fridge" scene.) It wasn't until the end when I said to myself "oh....no they didn't."

Pirates 4 is actually a pretty good movie by itself. I guess my real issue with it is that it came after a massively huge battle of epic proportions from the last movie. My thoughts were, "okay so the other actors aren't in it, can I have a massive special FX-y moment to make up for it, please?" I didn't get that. Oh well, maybe in Pirates 5.

TF4 falls under the same situation. Just like Pirates 4, it follows a massively huge battle of epic proportions in the last movie.

That's a good point. Very high expectations for the next movie.

Ed Fuego

**almostthethird15** · 03-03-2012, 06:01 PM

if a new trilogy is starting up, I hope everyone doesnt hope for a film thats even bigger than DoTM. that would be the wrong thing to do. they need to take a step back. besides, it would still be incredibly action packed to begin with, cuz look at TF1.

**almostthethird15** · 03-03-2012, 10:34 PM

Originally Posted by Trailbreaker

I personally don't think that Crystal Skull is a bad film. In my view, the internet community likes to paint it as an absolute train wreck when it really isn't that bad. Yeah, it had problems, but I had a lot of fun watching it. (Yes, I even liked the "nuke the fridge" scene.) It wasn't until the end when I said to myself "oh....no they didn't."

Pirates 4 is actually a pretty good movie by itself. I guess my real issue with it is that it came after a massively huge battle of epic proportions from the last movie. My thoughts were, "okay so the other actors aren't in it, can I have a massive special FX-y moment to make up for it, please?" I didn't get that. Oh well, maybe in Pirates 5.

TF4 falls under the same situation. Just like Pirates 4, it follows a massively huge battle of epic proportions in the last movie. I just hope Mike will top himself once again with TF4.

Speaking of crystal skull, I'm watching it on usa right now haha! I actually really like that film. The only bad part was the bad special effects in some parts, which was pretty much only the monkeys. Other than that, it had all the things that made Indiana Jones great.

But anywho, we got to remember that transformers isnt returning from some twenty year break or however long that was, and bay will still be making the film unlike the different director of pirates four. So I don't think transformers has to worry about anything. Plus I like to think that ROTF is the lowest transformers can go, so anything will be considered good in my opinion.