Blu-Ray or HD DVD

[nelson]

Vote on your preference.

[Bumblebee1983]

I voted both because they both have their pros and cons. :D

Nelson, I find it hilarious you put the VHS option up there. :cool:

[krawhitham]

I voted HD-DVD

They both can produce the same quality movies but unlike Blu-Ray any HD-DVD player I buy today will always be able to play future movies and all of the extra features.

HD-DVD is cheaper for both the consumer and for disc manufacturing, not everyone has Michael Bay money and can go out and buy another player when Sony finally decides what Blu-Ray's final specs will be.

One would think with Michael Bay being a film creator he would support the format that allows amateur file makers to product HD-DVD quality short movies on normal DVDs using 3x DVD. (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/HD_DVD#3x_DVD)
Blu-ray does have BD9, but the PS3 which is currently 99% of all Blu-Ray players does not accept this format. Sony will not allow this because it could damage the PS3 security against pirated games if it does. Like I said before it would be wonderful if all Blu-Ray players had one set of standards/specs.

[Dennis M]

I voted HD-DVD

They both can produce the same quality movies but unlike Blu-Ray any HD-DVD player I buy today will always be able to play future movies and all of the extra features.

Voted HD for the same reasons.

[D3lta]

I voted Blu-ray simply because I prefer the current movies. All we need is Warner Bros. to go Blu-ray-online and it's all over.

[nathan alexander]

I'm really ignorant... I don't know the difference. But last year I bought an LG DVD Recorder/Video Cassette Recorder for over 200 Euros. From the beginning it didn't recognize some of my DVDs. After a couple of recordings, the quality of the VHS player really deteriorated. I took it back on the guarantee, they kept it for two months, and it still didn't work properly after that. Now it's completely broken... and out of guarantee.
After a while you can get really sick of all this stuff, and for young guys like me it can get really expensive.

[Mech_1000]

None, im too poor for either >.< The life of a college student *cheers ramon noodles for dinner*

[Johnny LaPhlegm]

I voted for both since I'm a fan of high-def movies, not flipping formats.

[IMT Guyver]

Well i voted :confused:.......for both since i own both format player.
Sorry to say i still have a Beta and VHS video players and yes i still use them.
so which ever way this HD or Blu Ray war go's i can't lose.:D

Dam this Format war reminds me of the BETA vs VHS format war:eek:

[rdjam]

HD DVD is my choice.

There is a very good discussion of the reasons here in HDTV Magazine - http://www.hdtvmagazine.com/articles/2007/11/which_is_more_consumer_friendly_hd_dvd_or_blu-ray.php

[ClaytonMG]

I voted HD-DVD

They both can produce the same quality movies but unlike Blu-Ray any HD-DVD player I buy today will always be able to play future movies and all of the extra features.

HD-DVD is cheaper for both the consumer and for disc manufacturing, not everyone has Michael Bay money and can go out and buy another player when Sony finally decides what Blu-Ray's final specs will be.

One would think with Michael Bay being a film creator he would support the format that allows amateur file makers to product HD-DVD quality short movies on normal DVDs using 3x DVD. (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/HD_DVD#3x_DVD)
Blu-ray does have BD9, but the PS3 which is currently 99% of all Blu-Ray players does not accept this format. Sony will not allow this because it could damage the PS3 security against pirated games if it does. Like I said before it would be wonderful if all Blu-Ray players had one set of standards/specs.

Until tripple layered discs come out... But if you want more information on both formats, I suggest going over to the other thread. There's a lot of useful things in there (like how to get a 1080/24p HD DVD player, you're going to spend as much on it as you would a Blu-Ray player).

[knicks2892]

Voted blu-ray simply because it has the movies that I prefer on its side. Forget about price for a second and think what you are buying. It has both quality and quantity over HD-DVD.

It is just me as it is my preference but blu ray is just more convienient for me although I do own an hd-dvd add on or my 360. I am a huge disney buff so theres a starter and in my area for the very least the retailers that are closest to me stock very little hd-dvd.

[Ranger]

Until tripple layered discs come out... But if you want more information on both formats, I suggest going over to the other thread. There's a lot of useful things in there (like how to get a 1080/24p HD DVD player, you're going to spend as much on it as you would a Blu-Ray player).

First, let's keep in mind that most people own HDTV's that can't accept higher than 1080i input. Of those who own 1080p capable HDTV's very few can acccept 1080p24.

If you're one of the lucky ones who actually owns a 1080p24 display, you can pick up the latest 3rd generation HD-A30 from Amazon (or other sites) for $250. You can buy a bunch of movies with the money you saved over a Blu-ray player.

[FastEddie]

My vote is for Blu-Ray, anyone that says HD-DVD is a better format is a fool. Now that doesnt mean that picture quality or audio quality is currently much better in either format but that is currently, not in the future. So you can argue how simular this movie looked to that movie, or how Transformers on HD-DVD has great sound,but Blu-Ray has higher bitrate and greater capacity. The 51g HD-DVD is nothing when compaired to a 100g or 200g Blu-Ray. And anyone that says most movies currently fit on 25g and 30g discs so we dont need the extra space is just being dumb. With greater capacity, we can increase bitrates,use less compression,and with the greater size you can one day have multiple versions of movies or entire hd trilogys with bonus hd content on single discs. HD-DVD Works for now, Blu-Ray works for the future.

Remember, we are going to be using this format for a while if DVD is any indication, and in a few years I bet ALOT more people will have 1080p sets.

[Ranger]

My vote is for Blu-Ray, anyone that says HD-DVD is a better format is a fool. Now that doesnt mean that picture quality or audio quality is currently much better in either format but that is currently, not in the future. So you can argue how simular this movie looked to that movie, or how Transformers on HD-DVD has great sound,but Blu-Ray has higher bitrate and greater capacity. The 51g HD-DVD is nothing when compaired to a 100g or 200g Blu-Ray. And anyone that says most movies currently fit on 25g and 30g discs so we dont need the extra space is just being dumb. With greater capacity, we can increase bitrates,use less compression,and with the greater size you can one day have multiple versions of movies or entire hd trilogys with bonus hd content on single discs. HD-DVD Works for now, Blu-Ray works for the future.

Remember, we are going to be using this format for a while if DVD is any indication, and in a few years I bet ALOT more people will have 1080p sets.

For the record, Blu-ray has a maximum Video bandwidth of 40mbps and a maximum Audio bandwidth of 8mbps. These are hard fixed limits for every Blu-ray player. Assuming that Blu-ray can actually support 100GB and 200GB discs in existing players (that's a big if), it doesn't give them the ability to encode at higher bandwidth. HD DVD supports 30.6mbps for both Video and Audio combined.

The higher bandwidth on Blu-ray was needed in order to get good results from Mpeg2, the oldest of the video codecs supported by both formats.

Blu-ray Movies Hit Stores Today
http://www.pcworld.com/article/id,126163-page,1/article.html



"We started working with Sony Japan a couple of years ago developing an MPEG-2 encoder specifically for this format," says Eklund. However, Eklund says the company has discovered other advantages to using MPEG-2. "Since then, we've also done some testing with VC-1 and MPEG-4 AVC. We're finding they have some advantages when encoding at very low bit rates, but those low bit rates, as compared with MPEG-2, do not yield transparent picture quality to the original master. When you're encoding, you need to encode the noise that is part of the film grain of that master as well."

"What makes the films most difficult to encode, actually, is noise. And to make the best approximation of it, you need to use the highest available bit rate," Eklund says. "The bit rate we use for our typical releases is 18 mbps [megabits per second] average, with a 30-mbps maximum. And that is one of the key differences for HD DVD and Blu-ray: We have a higher bandwidth available for encoding than HD DVD has. It gives us a lot of flexibility even when we're working with the most difficult video masters."

What Don didn't mention is that Sony had a big investment in Mpeg2 encoding equipment to preserve. Now that they are shipping much more efficient AVC/Mpeg4 encoding equipment they don't use Mpeg2 much anymore. So much for the superior results of Mpeg2.

The two new codecs that most movies are now being released on are AVC/Mpeg4 and VC1. These codecs will only become more efficient with time, not more bloated and inefficient. A movie at 1920x1080p24 is a movie at 1920x1080p24. Unless you think Hollywood is planning to move to 5+ hour movies, 100GB and 200GB discs are irrelevant.

For those buying into Blu-ray, keep in mind that you're also buying into the following DRM mechanisms: BD+, disc watermarking and region coding.

[wingzero]

For the record, Blu-ray has a maximum Video bandwidth of 40mbps and a maximum Audio bandwidth of 8mbps. These are hard fixed limits for every Blu-ray player. Assuming that Blu-ray can actually support 100GB and 200GB discs in existing players (that's a big if), it doesn't give them the ability to encode at higher bandwidth. HD DVD supports 30.6mbps for both Video and Audio combined.


The DVD-Forum raised the maximum allowed bitrate for 3-layer 51GB discs, so why Blu-Ray specifications couldn't add an higher bitrate as well for 4-layer 100GB and 6-layer 200GB discs ? Just like Blu-Ray Profile 1.1 and 2.0 add some features to the specifications, players compatible with the new multi-layer discs will simply need to support higher bitrates. I see no reason why the DVD-Forum can do that while the Blu-Ray organization shouldn't...




The higher bandwidth on Blu-ray was needed in order to get good results from Mpeg2, the oldest of the video codecs supported by both formats.

Blu-ray Movies Hit Stores Today
http://www.pcworld.com/article/id,126163-page,1/article.html

What are you talking about ? This is just a silly way of attacking Sony. Do you work for either Toshiba or Microsoft ? Or are you a Paramount employee supporting CEO decision to go HD-DVD exclusive and you have to say something against Sony at any cost ?
Telling that the higher allowed bitrate for muxed audio/video streams on Blu-Ray specifications was made in order to use MPEG-2 it's a really silly statement.



What Don didn't mention is that Sony had a big investment in Mpeg2 encoding equipment to preserve. Now that they are shipping much more efficient AVC/Mpeg4 encoding equipment they don't use Mpeg2 much anymore. So much for the superior results of Mpeg2.
Every manufacturer in the industry had an estabilished user base, hardware/software products and employees expertise for MPEG-2 built in the last 15+ years. The first MPEG-4 Part 10 H.264 capable DSPs appeared on the market from various manufacturers not much time ago, there have been design and debugging issues to address. H.264 hardware was too expensive but now it has started replacing MPEG-2 everywhere. VC-1 has never really been considered as an option.
So, what is your point ? Sony being evil and greedy while Microsoft,Toshiba,DVD-Forum being so kind towards everyone and willing to throw their MPEG-2 products and user base quickly ? Well, Microsoft surely yes since they had the smallest investments on MPEG-2 hardware/software compared to other manufacturers and just wanted to push WMV9 rebranded as VC-1 everywhere as it was the best codec around which is just not.



The two new codecs that most movies are now being released on are AVC/Mpeg4 and VC1. These codecs will only become more efficient with time, not more bloated and inefficient. A movie at 1920x1080p24 is a movie at 1920x1080p24. Unless you think Hollywood is planning to move to 5+ hour movies, 100GB and 200GB discs are irrelevant.
Moot point. More the space, higher the bitrate. And I bet that if they are going to add 100GB and 200GB discs to Blu-Ray specifications the maximum allowed bitrate will be raised so that producers can make use of the available space.



For those buying into Blu-ray, keep in mind that you're also buying into the following DRM mechanisms: BD+, disc watermarking and region coding.What is your point ? You seem really so biased. You want to make Sony look bad at any cost while trying to make Microsoft,Toshiba,DVD-Forum look good and customer friendly or allowing copies to be made.. that's just not the case at all !

HD-DVD features DRM copy protection spy-on-user mechanisms as well, being optional means nothing since 99% of studios are using the AACS system and it has been partially cracked at will trying to push the adoption of HD-DVD and for marketing reasons for sure.. it surely wasn't due to some little kid doing reverse engineering that it got cracked, unless you want to believe some fairy tales for the general public to justify the sudden appearence of such cracks and no real legal action to take them down.

From a Microsoft document on HD-DVD specifications is possible to read:

------
http://www.thisishddvd.com/Downloads/WhatIsHDDVD.pdf

Content Protection
HD DVD supports Advanced Access Content
System (AACS) to protect copyrighted
property and deter illegal copies from being
made. It provides flexibility for content
owners while remaining transparent to
legitimate users. AACS protection is optional
on HD DVD discs. If protection is required the
content owner determines the rules for
consuming the content and then they work
with an AACS licensed disc replicator to
manufacture the discs with the content
encrypted.
Audio watermarking, while not required, can
also be used in conjunction with AACS to
prevent the illegal use of content. An
inaudible watermark signal can be added to
the audio track indicating protection is
required. When an AACS-compliant player
detects the watermark signal and the content
is not protected, it recognizes it as illegal
content and deals with it accordingly. For
example, if a watermarked movie is copied
through an analog hole that circumvents
AACS, it will contain the watermark but it will
not be AACS protected so compliant players
will not playback the movie.
At this time, recordable media does not
support AACS for HD DVD.

-------


And then, regarding the current lack of Regional Coding on HD-DVD discs.. that is not going to last any longer if HD-DVD ever survives the format war or worse it would replace Blu-Ray.. DVD-Forum, Toshiba and Microsoft are already working on specifications update to include Regional Coding:

------
http://arstechnica.com/news.ars/post/20060526-6927.html

HD DVD to carry unwelcome DVD baggage (http://arstechnica.com/news.ars/post/20060526-6927.html)

By Eric Bangeman (http://arstechnica.com/authors.ars/I+Palindrome+I) | Published: May 26, 2006 - 01:25PM CT
Perhaps capitulating to studio pressure, the DVD Forum has moved (http://www.reghardware.co.uk/2006/05/26/hd_dvd_to_get_region_coding/) to burden the next-generation HD DVD format with region coding similar to that of its predecessor. Called Region Protection Coding, the new specification will function in much the same way as current DVDs do: restricting players from showing content from discs purchased outside of the player's region. The number of regions and the geographies they each will cover are not yet known.
Blu-ray is also using (http://arstechnica.com/news.ars/post/20051228-5857.html) region encoding, narrowing the seven regions of the current DVD specification down to three. In a somewhat curious move, Blu-ray is combining the Americas and much of Asia into a single region, meaning that US anime fans will be able to easily import and watch the latest and greatest from Japan for viewing on their PlayStation 3 or US$1,000 Blu-ray players.
If RPC is ultimately approved and incorporated into the HD DVD format, it is unclear how the players that have already been sold will handle it. The most logical solution would be to allow the current handful of HD DVD players already on the market to play any HD DVD. Unfortunately, history tell us that logic is not one of the entertainment industry's strong suits, so it's not outside the realm of possibility that region-coded HD DVDs will cause problems for some early adopters.
Many have questioned the need for region coding at all. It is ostensibly an antipiracy measure, as it supposedly ensures that a DVD released in the US can't be shipped to southeast Asia, copied, and resold. In reality, region-free DVD players have been widely available in the past—before a studio-led crackdown— (http://arstechnica.com/news.ars/post/20060220-6219.html)and there other ways *cough*DeCSS*cough* around the issue.
--------

--------
http://www.dvdforum.org/33scmtg-resolution.htm

Updated February 22, 2006
33rd Steering Committee Meeting (Feb. 22, 2006)


14 Approval of "The RPC subcommittee's Request to SC:
-The RPC subcommittee to request input from studios regarding current and anticipated use of DVD-Video RPC system.
-The RPC subcommittee to request input from VPC regarding marketplace data regarding multi-region products.
-The RPC subcommittee to communicate with DVD CCA regarding RPC enforcement.
-The RPC subcommittee to consider possible change to region code map." approved

--------


http://www.dvdforum.org/35scmtg-resolution.htm

Updated September 12, 2006
35th Steering Committee Meeting (Sep. 12, 2006)


10 Approval of "The letter to be sent to DVD CCA from DVD Forum regarding multi region players currently available in the market place" approved

---------

http://www.dvdforum.org/34scmtg-resolution.htm

Updated September 12, 2006
34th Steering Committee Meeting (May 24, 2006)


6 Approval of
"HD DVD RPC Ad hoc group to work with appropriate WGs to develop a specification and enforcement plan for RPC on HD DVD-Video including region map and requirements in consultation with the studios" Approved
---------

[nokia6250tank]

Vote on your preference.

excuse me , may I ask a little question

will Mr. Bay vote this? if he voted can we know which one he chose?


THANK YOU.

[PeteS]

In answer to your question about Michael Bay's opinion, here's a quote from the man himself:

"What you don't understand is corporate politics. Microsoft wants both formats to fail so they can be heroes and make the world move to digital downloads. That is the dirty secret no one is talking about. That is why Microsoft is handing out $100 million dollar checks to studios just embrace the HD DVD and not the leading, and superior Blu Ray. They want confusion in the market until they perfect the digital downloads. Time will tell and you will see the truth."

You see HD-DVD only has two main supporters: Toshiba and M$. In 2005 it appears Toshiba was ready to drop HD-DVD and M$ somehow made them stick with it. Blu-Ray *is* the superior format (lossless audio and higher bit rates) and has wider industry support.

[BStecke]

Blu-ray . . . at its best it's better quality picture and sound. At its worst it's HD DVD :D

I don't care what anybody says, Toshiba doesn't compete with Pioneer Elite, Denon, etc. I don't want a Toshiba player, and nobody wants to make an HD DVD player other than Toshiba.

Also, for the money you save on the HD DVD player you can buy more movies, huh? I guess if you only like Universal, since Paramount has been pretty lackluster since the switch, Weinstein is MIA, and I can get Warner on Blu-ray with PCM audio, along with every other studio.

[Snowgod]

I voted Blu because it is the Future. HD-DVD is the past being dragged out at the expense of the consumer.:cool:

[jkwest]

I voted Blu-Ray.

[JuanitoCinco]

Blu, beacause the play in my PS3 which will also upscale regular DVDs to HD for anything thats not available on Blu, thou blu sounds and looks the best:cool:

[Mericalis]

Have been a lurker around these boards for some months now. Finally decided to register because I feel this is an important vote.

So, I voted my preference: Blu-ray.

[Fiddle-dee-dee]

I think Blu-ray's the only format that would allow an entire Lord of the Rings movie to be stored on one 50GB disk with artifact-free video and lossless audio. To achieve the same quality the movie would need to be spread across two 30GB HD DVD's.

I'm looking for a next-gen format that allows the movie to look and sound its best without splitting movies across disks. The higher storage capacity and Audio/Video bandwidth of Blu-ray obviously allows for that higher A/V quality.

I'm a big Bond fan so it obviously helps that MGM/Sony are on board with Blu-ray. I love Panasonic electronics so that helps too.

[Andreasa]

I voted Blu-Ray because of it's larger storage capacity and higher bandwidth!

I really dont see any advantage with HD DVD now since blu-ray are introducing PIP and Web-enabled movies as well.

Blu-Ray has the best technology and the most industry support and should be the obvious choice to replace DVD.

[teunis]

Voted Blu.
Future proof.

[Paden-Blu]

Blu.

End of discussion.

Hey Warner, let's END this thing!

[Bumblebee1983]

I think Blu-ray's the only format that would allow an entire Lord of the Rings movie to be stored on one 50GB disk with artifact-free video and lossless audio. To achieve the same quality the movie would need to be spread across two 30GB HD DVD's.

I'm looking for a next-gen format that allows the movie to look and sound its best without splitting movies across disks. The higher storage capacity and Audio/Video bandwidth of Blu-ray obviously allows for that higher A/V quality.

I'm a big Bond fan so it obviously helps that MGM/Sony are on board with Blu-ray. I love Panasonic electronics so that helps too.

Dayum, you bring up a good point.

:mad:

But I'm going HD direction for now, blu ray perhaps later next year. That way I won't miss out on anything.

[DrG]

The Doctor prescribes Blu Ray for better vision.

If you look at the stats. HD DVD cannot win this war. Their best outcome will be a stalemate and the public will not adopt High Def in large enough numbers. Blu ray at least has a chance to finish this stupid war.

[mystiksuicide]

Blu-Ray of course. By this time next year there will be no need for this discussion.

[Shawnsmail35]

Blu-ray:D of course

[msallaq]

blu ray all the way.:D

[javabear]

I love your work, Michael. I'm looking forward to all your work being released on Blu-ray. I'll buy them all in a heartbeat! Have a great day! :)

[Elandyll]

First, let's keep in mind that most people own HDTV's that can't accept higher than 1080i input. Of those who own 1080p capable HDTV's very few can acccept 1080p24.

If you're one of the lucky ones who actually owns a 1080p24 display, you can pick up the latest 3rd generation HD-A30 from Amazon (or other sites) for $250. You can buy a bunch of movies with the money you saved over a Blu-ray player.

If you will allow me, just pointing at a few problems here :)

1) More and More people will see the "Full HD" sticked on displays and get equipped with those. That simply means 1080p, which is arguably the best HD resolution you can get. You can get real nice full HD flat screens for $1500 or under now (e.g.: Panasonic has a 42" @ $1500 discounted + free 1080p BD30K Blu Ray player -value $499- at BB)

2) Samsung has reprice its full HD (1080p) player 1400 at $299.
You will have the Sony BDS 300 (a Full HD 1080p) player coming in at $299 or less within 1 week from now, it has been confirmed by wholesale insiders. So much for any "price advantage" HD DVD has for the same kind of outputs :)


Looking forward to own The Island in Blu Ray, and hopefully soon Transformers ;)

[wingzero]

Looking forward to own The Island in Blu Ray, and hopefully soon Transformers ;)

The Island Blu-Ray has been released in UK and some other european countries and it's region free:

http://www.amazon.co.uk/Island-Blu-ray-Ewan-McGregor/dp/B000RJEHK8/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&s=dvd&qid=1197321623&sr=8-1

[acro31]

Blu-ray is clearly the superior format.

[gearyt]

Just purchased my second Panasonic player, the BD30
what an awsome machine. The Pic's & sound from my Blu's
give me a tear to my eyes :eek:

[blubaysupporter]

Blue all the way!

:cool::cool::cool::cool:

(I'd put more cool smileys but I'm limited to only 4 images per post kekeke)

[octogonpc]

Tale of the tape says it all:
(BD = Blu-Ray Disc / HD = HD-DVD Disc)

Software Sales - BD: 70% / HD: 30% = Blu-Ray

Hardware Sales (US) - BD: 2400K / HD: 750K = Blu-Ray

Capacity - BD: 50GB (2 layer disc) / HD: 30GB (2 layer disc) = Blu-Ray

Uncompressed Audio - BD: YES / HD: NO = Blu-Ray

1st Tier Manufacturers - BD: 14 / HD: 3 = Blu-Ray

PC Drives - BD: 9 / HD: 2 = Blu-Ray

Picture-In-Picture Functionality - BD*: NO / HD: YES = HD-DVD

When you add it all up,

BLU-RAY IS THE WINNING FORMAT!!
:cool:

* - NOTE: Profile 1.1 is coming to correct this

[Ranger]

Boy, all I can say is Welcome!!!! to all the Blu-ray.com members who just showed up.

Vote Blu at M. Bay's Site
http://forum.blu-ray.com/showthread.php?t=26569

I love that the person that started this thread felt the need to remind the members of Blu-ray.com which format they should vote for.

[BluRay4Eva]

Boy, all I can say is Welcome!!!! to all the Blu-ray.com members who just showed up.

Vote Blu at M. Bay's Site
http://forum.blu-ray.com/showthread.php?t=26569

I love that the person that started this thread felt the need to remind the members of Blu-ray.com which format they should vote for.

Yep, nice to meet ya :D Have a nice day Sir.

[Clutch]

At the moment, neither.

It seems like the current format war is a bunch of...well, what's the proper word...mud-slinging right now. Neither format has shown me that there's one thing that really stands out ahead of regular DVDs outside of improved picture quality, and indeed, a few movies are being released now in 2-disc editions on Blu-Ray and HD-DVD - something I would have thought would have been in the distant (but not-too-distant) future.

[wingzero]

At the moment, neither.

It seems like the current format war is a bunch of...well, what's the proper word...mud-slinging right now. Neither format has shown me that there's one thing that really stands out ahead of regular DVDs outside of improved picture quality, and indeed, a few movies are being released now in 2-disc editions on Blu-Ray and HD-DVD - something I would have thought would have been in the distant (but not-too-distant) future.


Sorry but... what where you expecting ? HDTV has been developed as a better tv broadcasting/video standard to replace the ancient SDTV (which has many issues due to its design in the '40s when valves technology and high production costs obliged to use interlacing and other tradeoffs...).

Movies on DVDs are not even real 16:9 but the widescreen MPEG-2 streams are encoded as 4:3 and samples at the correct aspect ratio get reconstructed realtime by the decoder.

[Tobi]

Boy, all I can say is Welcome!!!! to all the Blu-ray.com members who just showed up.

Vote Blu at M. Bay's Site
http://forum.blu-ray.com/showthread.php?t=26569

I love that the person that started this thread felt the need to remind the members of Blu-ray.com which format they should vote for.

LOL might as well put this poll up on BD.com and have the 13 people that voted HD DVD automatically banned.

[thrlride]

hd dvd for me.

[khainne]

I chose blu-ray for its wider support by consumer electronic companies. Hd-dvd seems like just an expansion to dvd, while the blu-ray format feels more from the ground up.

[FXSTBI]

Blu ray, if your going to spend the money on a hi-def player, you want the best picture and audio period.

How can HD DVD say "look and sound of perfect" when they can't even include the best audio or video codecs?

I'm sorry, but anyone who bought into HD DVD thinking it was the best, didn't do their homework, or just bought it because it was cheap.

[CptGreedle]

Absolutely Blu-ray!
HD DVD is to confusing, and the cheap players do not even support 1080p. The newest BD player is only $269 on amazon and it supports 1080p (here (http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B000TME35W/ref=s9_asin_title_1?pf_rd_m=ATVPDKIKX0DER&pf_rd_s=center-1&pf_rd_r=1M68V0YQX1455XVVBNEK&pf_rd_t=101&pf_rd_p=320448601&pf_rd_i=507846&tag=blurayforum-20))
The discs hold more, have better bandwidth, are adding profile 1.1 for interactivity and some even have 2.0 for web content both coming out in January, the PS3 is the best selling player with over 2.3 million sold, the discs have extra hard coat of protection HD DVD doesn't have, there are more studios supporting Blu-ray, more manufacturers of Blu-ray players, better sales in USA, UK, AU, and JPN (everywhere really), need I go on? I can if I must.
But I think the people know the truth, and they know which is the future.
We need the war to end now and if WB supports Blu-ray, there is a good chance Universal will join as well since that would give Blu-ray 70% of the HD market and Universal can not compete with that.
It is obvious to me that this entire thing is getting out of hand, and the only way to have a happy ending at all is for Blu-ray to win. Anything else and the formats will both fail.

[strannix136]

Hey. I'm a new Blu-ray member. I don't have any hateful feelings toward those who swear by HD-DVD, but I absolutely LOATHE Microsoft. :eek:

[Mirauder]

Bluray all the way.. sorry to see Transformers went on such a inferior product.Bring it to Bluray!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[xAgonyxScenex]

lol damn...110 to 14

[Pellaeon]

I voted for Blu Ray, not necessarily because it is the better product RIGHT NOW, but for what it has the potential to be. HD is step above DVD, while I believe Blu Ray has the potential to be at least a step above HD-DVD if not two.

The PS3 also gave me the ability to test the HDM waters with what I considered a lower risk method. So far my PS3 has been flawless.

I anxiously await the day I can by Transformers w/ uncompressed audio on Blu Ray !

[Ranger]

Blu ray, if your going to spend the money on a hi-def player, you want the best picture and audio period.

How can HD DVD say "look and sound of perfect" when they can't even include the best audio or video codecs?

I'm sorry, but anyone who bought into HD DVD thinking it was the best, didn't do their homework, or just bought it because it was cheap.

Both formats support the same video and audio codecs.

Player support for TrueHD is optional for Blu-ray but mandatory on HD DVD.

Ethernet ports for downloads and web enabled content are optional for Blu-ray but mandatory on HD DVD.

PiP is mandatory on Blu-ray profile 1.1 players, but not available on Blu-ray profile 1.0 players. PiP is mandatory on all HD DVD players.

[GPT]

I have owned several players from both formats as well as the PS3.
I can say with absolute certainty that Blu-ray is superior to hd dvd for player function in every single comparison.
Blu-ray has the absolute best looking movies and more of them by far.
Blu-ray has far more lossless and uncompresssed audio.
Blu-ray has the best studio support and will likely have Warner as an exclusive studio real soon.

Anyone who says they have tried both and they are the same is IMO a liar, or has such a small display with a total crap audio set up, that there opinion means squat.

Did I mention that all hd dvd players are a functioning nightmare?

[dobyblue]

Both formats support the same video and audio codecs.

Player support for TrueHD is optional for Blu-ray but mandatory on HD DVD.

Ethernet ports for downloads and web enabled content are optional for Blu-ray but mandatory on HD DVD.

PiP is mandatory on Blu-ray profile 1.1 players, but not available on Blu-ray profile 1.0 players. PiP is mandatory on all HD DVD players.

Decoding of 2 channel TrueHD is mandatory on HD DVD players, nothing more...which is hardly worth even mentioning. If the ability to decode multi-channel TrueHD AND OUTPUT IT was mandatory, you'd have a talking point.

Nobody with an HD DVD add-on for the 360 is capable of listening to any of the lossless audio tracks on HD DVD.

Blu-ray also has three times as many lossless audio tracks as HD DVD has, so that mandatory 2-channel decoding has not done much good has it? Perhaps bandwidth is a factor there as HD DVD only has 30.09 Mbps for A/V whereas Blu-ray has 48.00 Mbps.

As for players, if the goal is mass market adoption which would mean over 100,000,000 players then I'm sure the 400,000 players on the market without PIP abilities are in the hands of early adopters who knew full well what they were getting into, as early adopters do. My first DVD player didn't support dts audio, but by the time I had a 5.1 system I was on my second player which did support it.

[Flea77]

To anyone who has done their research it should be obvious that Blu-ray is the way to go, if not right this second, definitely for the future. I stopped buying regular DVDs quite a while back and only buy Blu-rays now.

[UTVOL06]

I voted Blu-ray. HD-DVD is the poor man's high def. If you want 2nd rate Picture and Sound quality go HD-DUD. If you want the best Picture Quality and Sound there is to offer the go Blu-ray. The price of Blu-ray players versus HD-DUD are narrowing. The movies cost the same.

Sorry, but I'd much rather go with a format that has future potential for improvements unlike HD-DuD which is stuck on a 30GB disc hoping for a tripple or Quad layer 45-50Gb disc is retarded. Those discs would cost more and be much harder to manufacture. Not to mention be more likely to make bad discs. On the other hand you have Blu-ray devloping a 100GB disc.

I don't want 2nd best and I want something that will last and offer more capacity for improvements.

[Dennis M]

Anyone who says they have tried both and they are the same is IMO a liar, or has such a small display with a total crap audio set up, that there opinion means squat.

WOW GPT that's a pretty loaded statement.

Here, let me list out my gear and see if it measures up for you.

Projector: JVC RS1 (ISF'd)

Screen: Stewart Ultrmatte 150 92" Dia. [16x9]

Preamp: Halcro SSP80 with new 7.1 MPCM over HDMI upgrade

AMP: Theta Dreadnaught II 5x225watts

Speakers: (L&R) Oskar Kithara's - full range, (C) Meadowlark Swan, (Surr.) Meadowlark Owls, (Sub) MJ Acoustics Ref I

Players: Toshiba A20 and Sony Ps3


There is no difference in PQ or AQ (when comparing lossless) between the two formats.

Now Blu ray has far more block busters with higher production values released. So that can skew perception. But tech wise, so far I'm not seeing a difference.

Guess that makes me a liar.:rolleyes:

Dennis

[Ranger]

Decoding of 2 channel TrueHD is mandatory on HD DVD players, nothing more...which is hardly worth even mentioning. If the ability to decode multi-channel TrueHD AND OUTPUT IT was mandatory, you'd have a talking point.

Nobody with an HD DVD add-on for the 360 is capable of listening to any of the lossless audio tracks on HD DVD.

Blu-ray also has three times as many lossless audio tracks as HD DVD has, so that mandatory 2-channel decoding has not done much good has it? Perhaps bandwidth is a factor there as HD DVD only has 30.09 Mbps for A/V whereas Blu-ray has 48.00 Mbps.

As for players, if the goal is mass market adoption which would mean over 100,000,000 players then I'm sure the 400,000 players on the market without PIP abilities are in the hands of early adopters who knew full well what they were getting into, as early adopters do. My first DVD player didn't support dts audio, but by the time I had a 5.1 system I was on my second player which did support it.

Well good news then. Every stand alone HD DVD player supports TrueHD 5.1 (the entry level A2 and A3 can't ouput it, the rest of the models can). What percent of Blu-ray models support TrueHD 5.1 and its output?

Speaking of which, are there any Blu-ray players that support DD+? I ask because Transformers won for best Audio Quality at High Def 2.0 with it's DD+ 1.5 mbps soundtrack. Can you imagine that it beat all of the Blu-ray lossless PCM titles at an award event where every Platinum sponsor is a Blu-ray exclusive company? It seems the company you work for is one of those Platinum sponsors as well. Is that correct?

As for all the folks who bought (and are still buying) the Blu-ray stand alones, that would be an interesting survey.

1. Do you realize that your player is based on an "interim profile" that is now considered obsolete?

2. Do you realize your "interim profile" player can't access the new features coming out in various Blu-ray titles starting in January?

3. Do you know your player manufacturers policy for continuing to provide your "interim profile" player with software updates to fix playback problems that may result from BD+ or implementation of new features on titles?

[Grubert]

1. Do you realize that your player is based on an "interim profile" that is now considered obsolete?


"Sir Winston, you are drunk!"

"Yes madam, I am and you are ugly. But I'll be sober in the morning."

[Dennis M]

"Sir Winston, you are drunk!"

"Yes madam, I am and you are ugly. But I'll be sober in the morning."

hahaha

Grubert that was a nice piece of levity there.:)

[dobyblue]

Well good news then. Every stand alone HD DVD player supports TrueHD 5.1 (the entry level A2 and A3 can't ouput it, the rest of the models can). What percent of Blu-ray models support TrueHD 5.1 and its output?

1. Do you realize that your player is based on an "interim profile" that is now considered obsolete?

2. Do you realize your "interim profile" player can't access the new features coming out in various Blu-ray titles starting in January?

3. Do you know your player manufacturers policy for continuing to provide your "interim profile" player with software updates to fix playback problems that may result from BD+ or implementation of new features on titles?


You're full of total bullshit, did you know that?
You don't even know what HD DVD players do TrueHD and what don't and you certainly don't seem to know which players can and cannot cannot support TrueHD.
You also seem to feel that a PCM track on a drama might best a rambunctious LFE-heavy, surround-busy audio track like Transformers in the eyes of a BD fan, which is just totally misleading. You also fail to mention that those peopel voting have probably never heard the audio on any of Fox's BD's at voting time either. How convenient for the 2.0 conference! So what you're suggesting is that based on the 2.0 awards we should have PQ encodes done higher than HD DVD is capable of with DD+ tracks done by the same team that did TF?
Yeah that will work. Fanboy much? You're a FUD-ster buddy that's the long and the short of it. Oh and those profile 1.1 discs? THe only thing you won't be able to do is watch the PIP over the movie - you will however be able to watch the PIP as a separate feature. Big bummer huh? (War was demonstrated on a DMP-BD10 a few weeks ago, it's a 1.1 title, the player is 1.0)

:rolleyes:

Oh and who I work for has nothing to do with anything, so drop the cute act.

[dobyblue]

WOW GPT that's a pretty loaded statement.

Here, let me list out my gear and see if it measures up for you.

Projector: JVC RS1 (ISF'd)

Screen: Stewart Ultrmatte 150 92" Dia. [16x9]

Preamp: Halcro SSP80 with new 7.1 MPCM over HDMI upgrade

AMP: Theta Dreadnaught II 5x225watts

Speakers: (L&R) Oskar Kithara's - full range, (C) Meadowlark Swan, (Surr.) Meadowlark Owls, (Sub) MJ Acoustics Ref I

Players: Toshiba A20 and Sony Ps3


There is no difference in PQ or AQ (when comparing lossless) between the two formats.

Now Blu ray has far more block busters with higher production values released. So that can skew perception. But tech wise, so far I'm not seeing a difference.

Guess that makes me a liar.:rolleyes:

Dennis

Perhaps - seems that most people with screens your size do notice a difference in PQ when comparing discs that have different encodes, like Nature's Journey for example.

Almost all like titles have the same encode so a comparison is meaningless.

For those that were different, like Flags of our Fathers and Nature's Journey, the Blu-ray gets the edge consistently in the details. Probably why Paramount had to get bought because they were about to start using high bitrate AVC on Blu and PCM but DD+ on TF and if anyone thinks TF had come out on Blu with PCM nd HD DVD with DD+ and still received that HDM 2.0 award for audio, they're kidding themselves.

[Dennis M]

Perhaps - seems that most people with screens your size do notice a difference in PQ when comparing discs that have different encodes, like Nature's Journey for example.

Almost all like titles have the same encode so a comparison is meaningless.

For those that were different, like Flags of our Fathers and Nature's Journey, the Blu-ray gets the edge consistently in the details. Probably why Paramount had to get bought because they were about to start using high bitrate AVC on Blu and PCM but DD+ on TF and if anyone thinks TF had come out on Blu with PCM nd HD DVD with DD+ and still received that HDM 2.0 award for audio, they're kidding themselves.

In terms of PQ, I've seen examples that swing to either HD or Blu. I think what plays a larger role in how good a title looks is the skill of the compressionist and the condition of the HD Master.
Have I compared the VC1 and AVC encodes of Flags of Our Fathers? Yes
Did I see a difference? When I walked up to the screen Yes. Was not appreciable at my regular viewing distance.
I'll let the guy's with 140" screens chime in.

I completely agree, comparing same encodes on both formats is a waste of time. They are the same.

About Paramount being bought, well... can't answer that. But there are all kinds of business reasons why that happened that are not related to tech specs.

But there may be a tech reason why Paramount choose VC1 over AVC. When I was a presentation last month a speaker from Rocket mentioned something very interesting. Rocket is a HD publishing house up here. They've done work on some of the discs already out in the wild. He stated that both codecs can deliver the same quality, and mpeg2 for that matter. But that VC1 was more flexible and substantially faster. He stated that it takes 6 to 7 times longer to encode with AVC. Maybe that played a role in Paramounts decision.

Edit: Most of the Paramount encodes on HD DVD are AVC so that could not have played much of a role.


Just because someone has a different opinion to yours does not make them a liar.

Things are not black and white. There are far to many variables in play to start throwing out absolutist statements.

I can appreciate people wanting to support their chosen format. But not when we start to shoot each other down.
Personally I could care less which format wins. I am not going to get caught up in a fight between corporations over future HDM royalties. For me it's about the movies and both formats deliver a great movie experience.

I've said it before, I don't see Toshiba or Sony cutting me a dividend cheque for support of their format. So at the end of the day does it really matter which format wins?

[Ranger]

"Sir Winston, you are drunk!"

"Yes madam, I am and you are ugly. But I'll be sober in the morning."

Nice one Grubert. So are those profile 1.0 players drunk or ugly? Or is it the folks buying them who will wake up with the hangover when they realize? ;)

Though it's completely unrelated, I've always enjoyed this particular Winston quote. :D

"Winston, if I were your wife, I'd put poison in your tea."

"Lady Astor, if I was your husband, I'd drink it."

[Ranger]

You're full of total bullshit, did you know that?
You don't even know what HD DVD players do TrueHD and what don't and you certainly don't seem to know which players can and cannot cannot support TrueHD.

Ok, so point out where I'm wrong.



You also seem to feel that a PCM track on a drama might best a rambunctious LFE-heavy, surround-busy audio track like Transformers in the eyes of a BD fan, which is just totally misleading. You also fail to mention that those peopel voting have probably never heard the audio on any of Fox's BD's at voting time either. How convenient for the 2.0 conference! So what you're suggesting is that based on the 2.0 awards we should have PQ encodes done higher than HD DVD is capable of with DD+ tracks done by the same team that did TF?

I know, it's upsetting. An event sponsored by Blu-ray exclusive CEs and studios, and the winner for best audio is Transformers on HD DVD with a DD+ 1.5mbps track. Why don't we just say that everyone voting was deaf, or maybe Grubert had it right, they were drunk. ;)



Yeah that will work. Fanboy much? You're a FUD-ster buddy that's the long and the short of it. Oh and those profile 1.1 discs? THe only thing you won't be able to do is watch the PIP over the movie - you will however be able to watch the PIP as a separate feature. Big bummer huh? (War was demonstrated on a DMP-BD10 a few weeks ago, it's a 1.1 title, the player is 1.0)

:rolleyes:

Oh and who I work for has nothing to do with anything, so drop the cute act.

Well that's nice that you can at least watch the PiP as a separate feature. Is that only on the DMP-BD10, or are there any other 1.0 players that can do this? How useful will that be with a title like 300 where the PiP can be popped up to compare the finished product against the blue screen version?

If you work for a company that stands to benefit financially from the success of Blu-ray, that seems very relevant.

[dobyblue]

Ok, so point out where I'm wrong.



I know, it's upsetting. An event sponsored by Blu-ray exclusive CEs and studios, and the winner for best audio is Transformers on HD DVD with a DD+ 1.5mbps track. Why don't we just say that everyone voting was deaf, or maybe Grubert had it right, they were drunk. ;)



Well that's nice that you can at least watch the PiP as a separate feature. Is that only on the DMP-BD10, or are there any other 1.0 players that can do this? How useful will that be with a title like 300 where the PiP can be popped up to compare the finished product against the blue screen version?

If you work for a company that stands to benefit financially from the success of Blu-ray, that seems very relevant.

It would only be relevant to someone trying to be an asshole.
My salary doesn't depend on the success of Blu-ray and neither does Matsushita as a whole. Blu-ray is small pittance compared to how many phones, TV's, microwaves, etc., Panasonic sells. AVC encodes will also work on HD DVD and Panasonic's PHL factory in Torrence, California runs off a hundred times more DVD's than they do Blu-ray's and could easily run off HD DVD's as well. So no, it's not relevant, not in the slightest.

As for Blu-ray players, 99% of them can output TrueHD losslessly, only about 60% of HD DVD players can.

As for the HD 2.0 conference, you're suggesting that the awards and panelists should have been bought out by the companies that were sponsoring the event? Sorry, shit like that doesn't happen in Blu-land, you're thinking of the HD DVD Propaganda Group and how they have to pay a studio $150 million in incentives to come on board exclusively for 18 months.

You're presented with certain facts like the dts-MA issue and how separate movies are encoded and you come back with the drunk and/or deaf comment. Way to avoid the issue and use misdirection, you've been learning from rdjam haven't you?

[Dennis M]

As for Blu-ray players, 99% of them can output TrueHD losslessly, only about 60% of HD DVD players can.

Ummmm, dobyblue every HD DVD player can decode TrueHD 5.1 over HDMI.:confused:
Were did you get this little piece of info from?

I think both you and Ranger need to chill and just enjoy your format of choice.

[Ranger]

It would only be relevant to someone trying to be an asshole.
My salary doesn't depend on the success of Blu-ray and neither does Matsushita as a whole. Blu-ray is small pittance compared to how many phones, TV's, microwaves, etc., Panasonic sells. AVC encodes will also work on HD DVD and Panasonic's PHL factory in Torrence, California runs off a hundred times more DVD's than they do Blu-ray's and could easily run off HD DVD's as well. So no, it's not relevant, not in the slightest.

Now I'm confused. This seems to be a Howard Stringer style statement about how the success of Blu-ray doesn't really matter that much to Sony, only this time applied to Panasonic/Matsushita. I thought Blu-ray was very important to Panasonic/Matsushita. Doesn't your company have big investments in this market?


As for Blu-ray players, 99% of them can output TrueHD losslessly, only about 60% of HD DVD players can.
High-Def FAQ: Blu-ray and HD DVD Audio Explained

http://www.highdefdigest.com/news/show/1064

HD DVD
Dolby TrueHD
What it is: Once decoded, the lossless Dolby TrueHD format is bit-for-bit identical to the studio master (at either 16-bits or 24-bits, at the discretion of the studio).
Level of support: Support for TrueHD up to at least 2 channels is mandatory on all HD DVD players, but the majority will support it all the way to 5.1. Because there are rare cases of disc players that limit TrueHD to 2 channels (such as the LG model BH100), discs with TrueHD tracks must also contain a Dolby Digital Plus track for 5.1 compatibility.
Examples of discs that use it: '300 (http://hddvd.highdefdigest.com/887/300.html)', 'Superman Returns (http://hddvd.highdefdigest.com/146/supermanreturns.html)'.
How to get it:

Toslink or Coaxial SPDIF - SPDIF cannot transmit TrueHD in full quality. When using this connection method, the player will decode the TrueHD and then transcode it to either standard Dolby Digital AC-3 or possibly DTS (depending on player model).
HDMI - Almost all HD DVD players decode the TrueHD track internally to PCM for transmission over HDMI. Some may transmit the TrueHD bitstream to a receiver instead (HDMI 1.3 required).
Multi-channel analog - The player will decode the TrueHD track and convert it to analog.I did make one mistake on this as DennisM pointed out. It seems that even the entry level HD-A2 and HD-A3 can output TrueHD 5.1 as lossless PCM over HDMI.

Here's the section on Blu-ray support of TrueHD. It doesn't seem like 99% to me. Maybe you can clarify.

Blu-ray
Dolby TrueHD
What it is: Dolby TrueHD is a "lossless" compression codec. Although it is compressed to take up less disc space than a PCM track, once decoded it is bit-for-bit identical to the studio master (at either 16-bit or 24-bit resolution, at the discretion of the studio). It may help to think of it like a ZIP file that holds a PCM track. Once you unZIP the file, you get a 100% identical copy of the original PCM, without compromising any sound quality.
Level of support: TrueHD is an optional format on Blu-ray. And since TrueHD is not built in a core+extension configuration, Blu-ray discs that contain a TrueHD track are also required to contain a standard Dolby Digital AC-3 track for compatibility with players that don't support TrueHD.
Examples of discs that use it: 'Ghost Rider (http://bluray.highdefdigest.com/800/ghostrider.html)', 'The Fifth Element' (Remastered) (http://bluray.highdefdigest.com/894/fifthelement_remastered.html).
How to get it:

Toslink or Coaxial SPDIF - SPDIF cannot carry a TrueHD signal. If using this connection type, the player will automatically revert to playing back the standard Dolby Digital AC-3 track instead.
HDMI - If the player does not support TrueHD, it will revert to the standard Dolby Digital track. Some players may decode the TrueHD to PCM and transmit it over any version of HDMI. Other players will instead transmit the TrueHD bitstream to a receiver for decoding (HDMI 1.3 required).
Multi-channel analog - Either the Blu-ray player will decode the standard Dolby Digital track, or (on some models) will decode the TrueHD and convert it to analog.

As for the HD 2.0 conference, you're suggesting that the awards and panelists should have been bought out by the companies that were sponsoring the event? Sorry, shit like that doesn't happen in Blu-land, you're thinking of the HD DVD Propaganda Group and how they have to pay a studio $150 million in incentives to come on board exclusively for 18 months.

Ok, the BDA is pure and honest. They don't do anything underhanded or deceptive. They don't sell customers on Blu-ray 2.0 features with in store looped video demos and then collect their cash on a profile 1.0 player that can't support those features. They are as honest and trustworthy as the local parish priest.


You're presented with certain facts like the dts-MA issue and how separate movies are encoded and you come back with the drunk and/or deaf comment. Way to avoid the issue and use misdirection, you've been learning from rdjam haven't you?

I didn't see you explicitly mention dts-MA. Here's the thing, we've already lost pretty much everybody who may have been reading this. Do we want to dive deeper on this subject?

You never answered my direct question. Is there any profile 1.0 player besides the DMP-BD10 that can play the PiP content on new discs as a separate feature?

[Johnny LaPhlegm]

Here's the thing, we've already lost pretty much everybody who may have been reading this. Do we want to dive deeper on this subject?
Aw, c'mon! What else am I going to do on my lunch break?

[Ranger]

Aw, c'mon! What else am I going to do on my lunch break?


Wow! There's someone still reading this crap?:D

[C6 Z06]

Blu.

[Grubert]

Nice one Grubert. So are those profile 1.0 players drunk or ugly? Or is it the folks buying them who will wake up with the hangover when they realize? ;)

The players might be 'ugly.' The format itself was 'drunk' and it suddenly sobered up yesterday when the PS3 got 1.1 support.



Though it's completely unrelated, I've always enjoyed this particular Winston quote. :D

"Winston, if I were your wife, I'd put poison in your tea."

"Lady Astor, if I was your husband, I'd drink it."

Excellent. :D

[Ranger]

The players might be 'ugly.' The format itself was 'drunk' and it suddenly sobered up yesterday when the PS3 got 1.1 support.

Excellent. :D

Let me know when you start enjoying those 1.1 features. Better yet, let me know when you've got profile 2.0. This whole Internet thing is a real blast. ;)

[RiseDarthVader]

HD DVD all the way!

[MR BLU]

Blu-ray is better..... and its winning.

:cool:

P.S. I'm sure Bay agrees ;)

[D3lta]

I think it's pretty clear what the choice will, whether you like it or not...

http://www.highdefdigest.com/news/show/Warner/Breaking:_Warner_Goes_Blu-ray_Exclusive/1325

[Double]

It's official, Warner goes blu-ray. I guess Neo will be taking the Blu pill.

http://www.engadgethd.com/2008/01/04/warner-goes-blu-ray-exclusive/

[dobyblue]

Let me know when you start enjoying those 1.1 features. Better yet, let me know when you've got profile 2.0. This whole Internet thing is a real blast. ;)

I'll be happier just watching the movies without someone else deciding when my movie pauses.

As for downloadable content, all 1.1 players will have SD slots that additional trailers, subtitles, features, etc., can be downloaded onto and played with the disc. So there's not really much missing if you don't care about ordering Harry Potter toilet paper in real time.

Speaking of which, the next Harry Potter movie will be Blu-ray exclusive.

Amen, the best format won.

[Spanbauer]

As for downloadable content, all 1.1 players will have SD slots that additional trailers, subtitles, features, etc., can be downloaded onto and played with the disc. So there's not really much missing if you don't care about ordering Harry Potter toilet paper in real time.
Except the only Blu-Ray player on the market with an ethernet jack is the PS3, so the 370,000 people who bought a standalone Blu-Ray player are going to have to replace their player when Blu-Ray finally finishes their format.

[Trigger Mike]

Except the only Blu-Ray player on the market with an ethernet jack is the PS3, so the 370,000 people who bought a standalone Blu-Ray player are going to have to replace their player when Blu-Ray finally finishes their format.

Or do firmware updates by burning a CD. Pretty simple to do and it has been working so far.

[richard l.]

For hd dvd it's all over with the lying, but the crying. Something like that.

I feel bad for the people who were duped by the numerous fabrications from the hd dvd supporters who constantly made up pointless arguments like attach rates, and replication costs.

Profile confusion speak about gimmicky, interactive features that the majority of people never use. There was a poll done by Universal studios where they concluded that only 10% of the people who used the web-enabled features went back to them a second time.

I only want my movies in the best audio and visual quality available and that is why I am ecstatic that the format with greater capacity and bandwidth (data transfer) has now essentially won.

Thanks Mr. Bay for being a supporter of the format with the best capabilities to bring your artistic visions to life.

[dobyblue]

Except the only Blu-Ray player on the market with an ethernet jack is the PS3, so the 370,000 people who bought a standalone Blu-Ray player are going to have to replace their player when Blu-Ray finally finishes their format.

It's rather obvious that you don't know what you're talking about.

[Double]

Except the only Blu-Ray player on the market with an ethernet jack is the PS3, so the 370,000 people who bought a standalone Blu-Ray player are going to have to replace their player when Blu-Ray finally finishes their format.

Actually the current Samsung and Pioneer players have ethernet, and the next Sony and Panasonic players will as well.

[MR BLU]

PS3 takes care of all these firmware problems... and its at the best price.

[darthrage]

Someone mentioned they both have their pros and cons.

And then one said HD-DVD is cheaper than Blu-Ray but I see they're the same price at various retailers. Do you mean cheaper for the consumer or cheaper for the manufacturer?

I don't see how either could have cons. They both look great. I love watching movies in High Definition. What could possibly be bad about it?

[StefsChemicalRomance]

Someone mentioned they both have their pros and cons.

And then one said HD-DVD is cheaper than Blu-Ray but I see they're the same price at various retailers. Do you mean cheaper for the consumer or cheaper for the manufacturer?

I don't see how either could have cons. They both look great. I love watching movies in High Definition. What could possibly be bad about it?

I totally agree - The only other person on the planet i found with the same views :D Lol

They dont have pros or cons. They both have Pros.. No Cons.

Its all new technology, theres bound to be no cons [in a sense... dont argue that, came out wrong lol]

But what did i vote? None.

Ill stick to my DVDs for now, until there is a proven leader. ill probably stay on DVD Lol:cool:

[Houston2007]

I voted Blu-Ray I got 58 Blu-Ray Movies because of Buy 1 Get 1 FREE Deals compared to my 14 HD-DVD. I had the HD-DVD addon for 360 I sold it for $120 plus Smoking Aces for $10. I really hate it ended like this but I seen Kingdom on HD-DVD it just while the picture looked good I'm really dissapointed that Universal dropped Dolby TrueHD audio track and left just the Dolby Digital Plus 1.5Mbps. Which proves Michael Bay's point on Transformers if it was on Blu-Ray we would have had Dolby TrueHD Audio at least 6 Mbps. I listened to Transformers output as DTS 1.5Mbps it sound good but it's not True DTS. I put War of the Worlds DVD with DTS then there's true mix of DTS. My 58 movies I chose are from studios of Disney, Sony , Warner Bros, New Line Cinema, Fox and MGM. What was the deciding factor was really the audio especially from Sony ,Disney and Warner because of PCM Uncompressed Audio then Fox ,MGM and New Line Cinema with DTS HD Master Audio. It just I supported Microsoft and Apple of their hardware and software. I been loyal to both. It sucks HD-DVD lost because it never was a junk technology it really was the way to get HD audio/video without upgrading almost everything at real low price. I got to get a 1080p HDTV LCD prefered then a HDMI 1.3a Audio Receiver then Playstation 3. Blu-Ray may been technically better but costly in the long run. Now since theres no competition that means the real monopoly begins with $30-$40 movies and no sales. Michael Bay wants Transformers on Blu-Ray but at how much? $34.99? Cause I see inflated prices from Paramount to make up for losses.

[chinmoku]

Warner Bros. Entertainment to Release its High-Definition DVD Titles Exclusively in the Blu-Ray Disc Format Beginning Later This Year (http://www.timewarner.com/corp/newsroom/pr/0,20812,1700383,00.html)

[phoenix]

guys save your money, pretty soon HD downloads will be possible.

[darthrage]

guys save your money, pretty soon HD downloads will be possible.

anybody who buys Hi-Def movies won't care about HD downloads. Why do you think they are waiting for Transformers on Blu-Ray? So they can have it on Blu-Ray disc obviously, not a virtual copy of it.

You'll be losing money after you pay all that money for a huge collection and upgrade your hard drive for massive capacity to store all your movies only to find out your hard drive gets fried and then you lose all your movies. And then you'll be kicking yourself especially if you sold all your DVDs because you thought HD downloads was perfect.

Movie/DVD buffs are proud of their collections. Having a hard drive full of movies devalues the whole movie buff experience. Its just like when you modify your xbox and then you download crap loads of games in it. Like maybe 1000 games. You only end up playing 50 of those games and you spend no more than 10 minutes on each and then play a new game and then continue that cycle and don't play it again. The fun is gone because the whole experience is cheapened.

When people start downloading movies as the mainstream norm, they will find that they will be less of a movie buff than they were before.

[phoenix]

the $500 dollars you spend on a blu ray player is better spent buying 25 standard dvds.

standard dvds are fine with me.

[StefsChemicalRomance]

the $500 dollars you spend on a blu ray player is better spent buying 25 standard dvds.

standard dvds are fine with me.

I agree. :D

Theres some poeple [some on this forum... :p] That are 100% dedicated to either Blu-Ray or HD. But why so dedicated? You never moaned about standard DVDs until there was something slightly better. LOL

My opinion, if i save money NOT buying a new HD/BluRay player, Sweeeeet :D

[darthrage]

standard DVDs will always live on.

I feel like DVDs is the necessity and Hi-Def is luxury cuz even right now not everyone knows what HD-DVD or Blu-Ray is.

Today, I was picking up a package at the post office delivered from Deep Discount DVD. It was 3 Blu-Ray movies from their buy 2 get 1 free deal. So then I told her it was some movies. And then she asked what kind? And then I hesitated because I felt silly telling her they were Blu-Ray movies because I was quite positive that she wouldn't know what Blu-Ray even was so I didn't bother to mention the word to avoid having to have to explain it to her. So I just told her it was just some action flicks.

In other words, Hi-Def isn't the norm yet and won't be for a while.

[chinmoku]

standard DVDs will always live on.

I feel like DVDs is the necessity and Hi-Def is luxury cuz even right now not everyone knows what HD-DVD or Blu-Ray is.

Today, I was picking up a package at the post office delivered from Deep Discount DVD. It was 3 Blu-Ray movies from their buy 2 get 1 free deal. So then I told her it was some movies. And then she asked what kind? And then I hesitated because I felt silly telling her they were Blu-Ray movies because I was quite positive that she wouldn't know what Blu-Ray even was so I didn't bother to mention the word to avoid having to have to explain it to her. So I just told her it was just some action flicks.

In other words, Hi-Def isn't the norm yet and won't be for a while.

Correct. But in the near future one format will replace the DVD until another format will be developed/launched. And at present it looks like BR will be the format of the future.

And I think (like you did) that downloads won't replace physical mediums (DVD, Blu Ray).
I wanna hold something in my hands and don't want to switch the PC on, plug in the HD TV and watch my movies in 720p. I prefer the comfortable version yet: Switching on my Blu Ray/DVD Player and watch my movies.

[phoenix]

people will always want to hold on to their standard dvds just like people who still keep their record albums. because it's still good and it gives them what they need.

standard dvds got it where it counts.

[dvdvision]

I disagree, many standart DVDs look like crap on any HD ready or full HD plasma or LCD TV.

HD discs are a reality because they are a way to get the most out of the screens for sale out there. It's pretty obvious, once you upgrade to a 42" minimum flat screen, that DVD is not fitted for this format, or higher sets.

Of course you can still upscale and watch a DVD, but the difference is akin to the difference between VHS and DVDs on older sets. People who claim the difference is passable aren't just doing a proper comparison. I believe that by 2015, DVD will be gone and replaced by Blu-Ray everywhere.

Of course by then, the new thing will be 2K Blu discs ;)

Expect an upgrade every ten years, until we reach 4K, which will be equivalent to 35mm film.

[phoenix]

I disagree, many standart DVDs look like crap on any HD ready or full HD plasma or LCD TV.

HD discs are a reality because they are a way to get the most out of the screens for sale out there. It's pretty obvious, once you upgrade to a 42" minimum flat screen, that DVD is not fitted for this format, or higher sets.

Of course you can still upscale and watch a DVD, but the difference is akin to the difference between VHS and DVDs on older sets. People who claim the difference is passable aren't just doing a proper comparison. I believe that by 2015, DVD will be gone and replaced by Blu-Ray everywhere.

Of course by then, the new thing will be 2K Blu discs ;)

Expect an upgrade every ten years, until we reach 4K, which will be equivalent to 35mm film.

so i'll just skip blu ray and wait for the next next generation DVDs.

[MR BLU]

I agree. :D

Theres some poeple [some on this forum... :p] That are 100% dedicated to either Blu-Ray or HD. But why so dedicated? You never moaned about standard DVDs until there was something slightly better. LOL

My opinion, if i save money NOT buying a new HD/BluRay player, Sweeeeet :D

That's the thing about technology, there will always be something better... Once 1080p TVs and Blu-ray become the standard, UHDTVs and Terabyte Disc will be the standard. Eventually we'll get virtual stuff ;)

[phoenix]

That's the thing about technology, there will always be something better... Once 1080p TVs and Blu-ray become the standard, UHDTVs and Terabyte Disc will be the standard. Eventually we'll get virtual stuff ;)

5 years from now, there will be another format and sony will tell us we have to buy their new gear because the ones that we got from them this year is old stuff.

[Mobe1969]

I voted both. Back then I had no preference, as I was about to start researching and trying to pick a winner. The winner is painfully obvious. Can I change my vote now to "Blu Ray":confused:

[dobyblue]

5 years from now, there will be another format and sony will tell us we have to buy their new gear because the ones that we got from them this year is old stuff.

That "next format" could well be Blu-ray Disc as well.

Currently, 50GB, 48 Mbps, 2-layer

Potential, 335GB, 288 Mbps, 10-layer

Ritek already mentioned that they have potential 10-layer discs for Blu-ray and TDK's 200GB prototype disc used 33.5GB/layer instead of 25GB.

An 8x read speed would give 292.4 Mbps.

That would not only let you move up to 2160p if you wanted to, but would also allow for 1080p content with far less compression....although when watching the quality of Pixar's "Cars" one wonders if much more bandwidth is really needed, considering a 24-bit uncompressed PCM track was also included.

The only TV's above 1080p right now are used for professional purposes or for people with $6 million to spend on their home theater. A 52" 2160p set right now is over US$50,000.

I don't think a new resolution will be heading to consumers so quickly. We've been at 480i (NTSC) and 576i (PAL) for years and years. A new digital disc was needed to replace DVD so we could get 1080p24 content to consumers. All DVD did was allow us to watch NTSC digitally, instead of on tape.

5 years does not seem like a realistic timeframe.

[ScarCrow28]

http://www.nytimes.com/2008/02/16/technology/16toshiba.html?ex=1360904400&en=5edded7e6ac6213b&ei=5088&partner=rssnyt&emc=rss

Good article mentioning the secondary reasons for retailers dropping HD-DVD so suddenly and so fast. They see the impending battle with movie rental downloads and the like.


I'm not so sure it will be as terribly long to graduate to a HD Plus or HD Generation 2 resolution. The biggest gripe was the changeover from analog to Digital. The two just don't work well together. Once everything is digital from source to signal to monitor, things can scale up more easily with technology. It now becomes a matter of bandwidth speed. An issue that our country, the inventors of the internet, are seriously lacking behind in. Increase bandwidth speed, resolutions can increase with less drastic costs to the infrastructure.


But 5 years from now, Blu-Ray will be in its prime. And just starting to battle it out with downloads.

I think the next format war needs to be higher quality Audio recordings. Even now, mp3/ aac downloads are only 44.1khz 16bit. When will we finally see a 24bit / 96khz music standard?? I have a few DVDAudio titles and one DTS -Audio album. The sound is just awesome. Thats the war i want to see next.

[chinmoku]

Toshiba Corporation has decided to withdraw from next generation high-definition DVD production.

http://www.nhk.or.jp/daily/english/dailynews1.html

http://www.ps3fanboy.com/

[vogeler]

Blu-Ray !!!!!

[Mobe1969]

http://www.nytimes.com/2008/02/16/technology/16toshiba.html?ex=1360904400&en=5edded7e6ac6213b&ei=5088&partner=rssnyt&emc=rss

Good article mentioning the secondary reasons for retailers dropping HD-DVD so suddenly and so fast. They see the impending battle with movie rental downloads and the like.


I'm not so sure it will be as terribly long to graduate to a HD Plus or HD Generation 2 resolution. The biggest gripe was the changeover from analog to Digital. The two just don't work well together. Once everything is digital from source to signal to monitor, things can scale up more easily with technology. It now becomes a matter of bandwidth speed. An issue that our country, the inventors of the internet, are seriously lacking behind in. Increase bandwidth speed, resolutions can increase with less drastic costs to the infrastructure.


But 5 years from now, Blu-Ray will be in its prime. And just starting to battle it out with downloads.

I think the next format war needs to be higher quality Audio recordings. Even now, mp3/ aac downloads are only 44.1khz 16bit. When will we finally see a 24bit / 96khz music standard?? I have a few DVDAudio titles and one DTS -Audio album. The sound is just awesome. Thats the war i want to see next.Yeah, music downloads are pretty horrifically low density. I still buy CDs and convert them myself.

[dvdvision]

Now that HD-DVD is out, another format comes to bug Michael Bay, HD-VMD, the poor's man HD ! The fun continues ;)

http://www.nmeinc.com/

[Avalanche™]

oyea! i picked the right side of victory again! woo, i currently own a little over 50 Blu Ray movies, so of course i was rooting for Blu

and i said this the same time Paramount sided with HD-DUD, it will only prolong the inevitable

[dvdvision]

Avalanche, do you own a 2.0 compliant BD player ? Because if not, you're way more screwed than HD-DVD buyers will ever be. Apart from the PS3, all current Blu players will become useless very soon.

[chinmoku]

Now that HD-DVD is out, another format comes to bug Michael Bay, HD-VMD, the poor's man HD ! The fun continues ;)

http://www.nmeinc.com/

Hey, you forgot the Protein Coated Disc =()

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Protein-coated_disc

[Trigger Mike]

Avalanche, do you own a 2.0 compliant BD player ? Because if not, you're way more screwed than HD-DVD buyers will ever be. Apart from the PS3, all current Blu players will become useless very soon.

That's a bit of an exaggeration. They'll be unable to play certain special features, sure, but everything else will continue to work as it has always done. Oh, and the studios need to start including these features on the discs first.

Everyone keeps saying that anything under 2.0 is a paperwork. They are dead wrong.

[StormSailor]

So, an interesting tidbit online...

"Toshiba may not have officially cried uncle in the high-def format war, but it surely is coming soon, and it seems that Paramount might have already started planning ahead. The Digital Bits is reporting that several retail outlets have contacted them, claiming that Paramount Blu-Ray titles have suddenly started to pop up in their inventory software.

"Transformers is the most notable title that has been listed 'on order' or 'available for pre-order...'" (http://www.movieweb.com/dvd/news/79/26679.php)

Probably just rumor, and people/retailers getting excited over unconfirmed stories, but still interesting...

[MR BLU]

Well it official, Blu-ray won...:D

[Smokescreen_5]

Well it official, Blu-ray won...:D

That it is... . I just heard on the radio that Toshiba was throwing in the towel on their HD DVD's!!!! HA HA HA.. thats funny.. never bought an HD DVD anyways... Happened to pick up the PS3 that plays Blu-Ray.. so yeah.. umm.. when is Transformers gonna be put on Blu-Ray anyways? Oh, another question.. I know someone posted this once before and I tried searching thru posts but can't seem to find it.. someone posted a website that talked about the differences between dvd, hddvd and bluray, which had pictures and in depth information so you could actually have a visual of what was being discussed.. Whoever originally posted that link, could you post it again? Or at least message it to me? Thanks!

[Mobe1969]

It is now OFFICIALLY over:

http://www.toshiba.co.jp/about/ir/en/news/20080219_03.htm

[Dadi]

YEAH, TRANSFORMERS WILL COME SOON!!!! Ill BUY IT ! :D

[xAgonyxScenex]

It is now OFFICIALLY over:

http://www.toshiba.co.jp/about/ir/en/news/20080219_03.htm


WOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!!!! Wonder how I knew it would end up this way in August...but HD-DVD supporters couldnt. Talk about blind faith.

[vogeler]

YEEES!!! This is what I've whaited for! hopes the TRANSFORMERS get on blu-ray emediatly!! cause im going to buy it:D:cool:

[Mobe1969]

WOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!!!! Wonder how I knew it would end up this way in August...but HD-DVD supporters couldnt. Talk about blind faith.


Simply as you used your head and looked at the sales figures and trends, I guess. Just like I did. I didn't think it'd be over this quick though, but it was inevitible looking at the figures. I don't know when HDDVD had the last majority on even a single week (they didn't even manage with Transformers or Shrek), and the Since Inception figures were always getting smaller and smaller.

[MR BLU]

YEEES!!! This is what I've whaited for! hopes the TRANSFORMERS get on blu-ray emediatly!! cause im going to buy it:D:cool:

Pictures are now circulating of Transformers and other hddvd only titles already in the system for Blu at some stores...

Here is a pic from a guy at Circuit City:
http://i38.photobucket.com/albums/e138/Quaylie/transformersBD.jpg

Personally, I think Bay already knew encodes were ready for Blu :)

[Smokescreen_5]

Here's the full picture for you:

http://i40.photobucket.com/albums/e249/smokescreen_5/Transformers/CC_TFBD.jpg

[Double]

Hopefully Circuit City stays in Business long enough for us to get it...

[MangaMel]

Lol~ Ramen noodles. I still prefer DVD though...Still no idea and no time to read about Blue Ray thing...:P

[IMT Guyver]

Source link http://www.current.com.au/2008/02/20/article/HXGEAZOXNF.html
Blu-ray could still lose HD video war: Toshiba http://www.current.com.au/2008/02/20/article/images/spacer.gif
By Matthew Henry

SYDNEY: Toshiba claims that Sony’s victory in the high definition disc format war will be short lived due to the rise of HD digital video downloads over broadband, which the company claims was one of the key reason for abandoning HD DVD.

In a press conference this morning, Toshiba Australia general manager, Mark Whittard, said that while the US film and retail industries’ recent shift to support Blu-ray sealed HD DVD’s fate, other factors played a role in Toshiba’s abandonment of its high definition video disc business.

Whittard claims the penetration of both next generation disc formats is well below expectations while uptake of digital movie download services is accelerating, and could render HD discs redundant.

“We believe technology developments will soon leapfrog high definition discs, whether it be HD DVD or Blu-ray,” he claimed.

“This step is going to be leapfrogged by the next major format – digital content, internet downloads and video on demand.”

Whittard also identified DVD as a formidable competitor to Blu-ray.

According to figures quoted by Toshiba, total sales of HD movie discs reached a paltry $300 million last year compared to sales of over $23 billion for DVD discs.

Whittard claims Blu-ray will find it difficult to replace DVD in the same way DVD comprehensively replaced VHS.

Toshiba sold less than one million HD DVD players worldwide, and while Blu-ray has achieved higher penetration with the PS3, Whittard claims DVD will be “extremely difficult” for Blu-ray to overcome.

“DVD players still sell in their tens of millions worldwide today,” he said.

“DVD upscaling technology means you get near high definition quality, and to most people there is little discernable difference.”

However, while Toshiba is now moving towards a business model which will see it place more emphasis on other HD video delivery platforms, it has not ruled out joining the Blu-ray camp.

“You never say never, but at this stage there are no plans,” he said.

Toshiba's HD DVD players also have the potential for internet connectivity which gives them the potential to accept HD video streaming over ethernet connectivity, which could be utilised by the company in the future.



[Wed 20/02/2008 12:56:00]

This is just somthing i found today on the 21/02/08
personal i dont care. To me the format wars are over.

[dobyblue]

Downloadable HD content that comes on par with Blu-ray is still almost 20 years away.

The physical disc will be the dominant format during our lifetimes.

The current downloadable "HD" content from Apple and xbox Live is 720p with lossy Dolby 5.1 - it does not even hold a candle to Blu-ray.

Within the next year the players will be available for under $200 and the movie prices will drop too. Blu-ray will be adopted in a similar timeframe as DVD was moving forward now.

[Smokescreen_5]

Downloadable HD content that comes on par with Blu-ray is still almost 20 years away.

The physical disc will be the dominant format during our lifetimes.

The current downloadable "HD" content from Apple and xbox Live is 720p with lossy Dolby 5.1 - it does not even hold a candle to Blu-ray.

Within the next year the players will be available for under $200 and the movie prices will drop too. Blu-ray will be adopted in a similar timeframe as DVD was moving forward now.

Or you can figure out a way to get a PS3 for $129.99 errr.. I mean.. hmm.. interesting.. yesss... heh heh. ..

[Double]

Source link http://www.current.com.au/2008/02/20/article/HXGEAZOXNF.html
Blu-ray could still lose HD video war: Toshiba http://www.current.com.au/2008/02/20/article/images/spacer.gif
By Matthew Henry


“This step is going to be leapfrogged by the next major format – digital content, internet downloads and video on demand.”


“DVD upscaling technology means you get near high definition quality, and to most people there is little discernable difference.”

Toshiba's HD DVD players also have the potential for internet connectivity which gives them the potential to accept HD video streaming over ethernet connectivity, which could be utilised by the company in the future.



[Wed 20/02/2008 12:56:00]



What an ass. Like Mr. Bay said: Nobody's is going to watch full length movies at home on their Ipod.

True it's hard to tell the difference on say, a 32" LCD. But there is clearly a noticeable difference on 50"+.

And last time I checked, most BR players have ethernet connections on them. And those brands that don't, soon will.

[Mobe1969]

Source link http://www.current.com.au/2008/02/20/article/HXGEAZOXNF.html
Blu-ray could still lose HD video war: Toshiba http://www.current.com.au/2008/02/20/article/images/spacer.gif
By Matthew Henry

SYDNEY: Toshiba claims that Sony’s victory in the high definition disc format war will be short lived due to the rise of HD digital video downloads over broadband, which the company claims was one of the key reason for abandoning HD DVD.

In a press conference this morning, Toshiba Australia general manager, Mark Whittard, said that while the US film and retail industries’ recent shift to support Blu-ray sealed HD DVD’s fate, other factors played a role in Toshiba’s abandonment of its high definition video disc business.

Whittard claims the penetration of both next generation disc formats is well below expectations while uptake of digital movie download services is accelerating, and could render HD discs redundant.

“We believe technology developments will soon leapfrog high definition discs, whether it be HD DVD or Blu-ray,” he claimed.

“This step is going to be leapfrogged by the next major format – digital content, internet downloads and video on demand.”

Whittard also identified DVD as a formidable competitor to Blu-ray.

According to figures quoted by Toshiba, total sales of HD movie discs reached a paltry $300 million last year compared to sales of over $23 billion for DVD discs.

Whittard claims Blu-ray will find it difficult to replace DVD in the same way DVD comprehensively replaced VHS.

Toshiba sold less than one million HD DVD players worldwide, and while Blu-ray has achieved higher penetration with the PS3, Whittard claims DVD will be “extremely difficult” for Blu-ray to overcome.

“DVD players still sell in their tens of millions worldwide today,” he said.

“DVD upscaling technology means you get near high definition quality, and to most people there is little discernable difference.”

However, while Toshiba is now moving towards a business model which will see it place more emphasis on other HD video delivery platforms, it has not ruled out joining the Blu-ray camp.

“You never say never, but at this stage there are no plans,” he said.

Toshiba's HD DVD players also have the potential for internet connectivity which gives them the potential to accept HD video streaming over ethernet connectivity, which could be utilised by the company in the future.



[Wed 20/02/2008 12:56:00]

This is just somthing i found today on the 21/02/08
personal i dont care. To me the format wars are over.

What a load of shit. 720p is not HD. I know that is what the assholes in the industry refer to it as, but for FUCKS sake, there is a bigger difference between 720 and 1080 than from 480 to 720. 720 is MD (medium definition). And fucked if I want to fuck about storing terabytres of shit to keep a movie collection.

Fuck all these download naysayer fucksticks. Have digital downloads replaced DVD, or even come close? No? Not even a factor? Then why the FUCK do shit eating media fuck faces keep trundling out the same shit in the Blu ray argument. I wouldn't even take a piss on a 720p transfer. I'd water some plants instead.

[dvdvision]

It's true it's doubtful that 60% of current DVD household are Blu by 5 years times, I say it'll take at least 10 years, by then, the new thing will come which is 2K BR or 3D. Still will be HD thought.

I agree 720p is shit, it looks like little improved SD stuff. 1080p all the way !

[xAgonyxScenex]

WHAT IN THE FUCK!!! O_O

Am i fucking seriously seeing the poll numbers correctly?!?!?!?!?!?!

1258790 votes for blu ray!!!

Over a million fuckin people came here to vote for blu ray...theres no fuckin way that happened. Who messed with the #'s?1 haha

[ScarCrow28]

Downloadable HD content that comes on par with Blu-ray is still almost 20 years away.

The physical disc will be the dominant format during our lifetimes.

The current downloadable "HD" content from Apple and xbox Live is 720p with lossy Dolby 5.1 - it does not even hold a candle to Blu-ray.

Within the next year the players will be available for under $200 and the movie prices will drop too. Blu-ray will be adopted in a similar timeframe as DVD was moving forward now.

You say that, but yet Mp3s have changed the music industry drastically. Currently iTunes is the No. 2 Retail music store. And they are still stuck with DRM because the Record labels are holding a grudge against Apple & Steve Jobs.

Audiophiles, who are just as high-standard minded as those of us HDphiles. And while mp3s are stuck at a "less then cd-quality" sound and played on sub-audiophile ipods, receivers, computers & speakers, the general Joe Schmoe public really doesn't care as long as the overall user experience makes them satisfied.

Need another example? Just look at the iPhone. This article explains the point again.

http://www.macworld.com/article/132267/2008/02/edge.html

the iPhone has "slow" internet connection speed. Yet it has transformed the "superphone" industry. And more iPhone users are browsing the net then on any other phone. The user experience is just better.


Apple knows this and this isn't their first rodayo. And with talks of the economy going turdburgs up, The price point of Apple TV Vs current Bu-Ray (Just saw Sony's new 400 & 500 dollar models they plan to launch soon) and the overall user experience, Apple's HD downloads just may make a good size dent in the short term. And customers may then not see a reason to rush to optical disk anymore long term.

And as everyone knows, technology always gets better. You can bet Apple's HD downloads won't stay rentals forever. Nor will they stay 720p. All apple is waiting for is more widespread "Awesome" FiOS class network support across the country. Same as why they waited on the iPhone's 3G. And the movie studios want to see a proven downloads business model.

I love Blu-Ray just as much as any HDphile, but I wouldn't underestimate Apple TV's influence in the market.

[Bumblebee1983]

WHAT IN THE FUCK!!! O_O

Am i fucking seriously seeing the poll numbers correctly?!?!?!?!?!?!

1258790 votes for blu ray!!!

Over a million fuckin people came here to vote for blu ray...theres no fuckin way that happened. Who messed with the #'s?1 haha


Yeah, somebody's screwed with the numbers.

I demand a recount. :cool:

[dvdvision]

Itunes number two retail store ? My CDs are for sale in all itunes, and yet, I fail to sell more than 10 copies of each a year, when the same CD in stores pulls off 15 000 easy, and I'm talking cult forgotten french punk rock.

No, in itunes, you're just a lost word amongst millions of others, unless your Madonna, you don't sell jack.

mp3s didn't change the music industry, they just took the place of transistor radios. The industry killed music with CDs. Luckily, now vinyl is back and growing, but the damage will take a long time to be repaired.

If you're into punk, check out my site www.seventeenrecords.com

[Smokescreen_5]

Yeah, somebody's screwed with the numbers.

I demand a recount. :cool:

Looking at the Members List, there are 812 pages of people, 30 people per page, the math says at the most, 24,360 people. So yeah... the numbers were tampered with. With the average people that look at this website, I'd say a good number would be more around 400 votes for Blu - Ray.

[uraydo]

Yeah, somebody's screwed with the numbers.

I demand a recount. :cool:


This travesty has "theGreat" written all over it. I DEMAND JUSTICE.

[Smokescreen_5]

This travesty has "theGreat" written all over it. I DEMAND JUSTICE.

Hmmm... I figured the creator (nelson) of this thread/poll had something to do with it.

Guess its time to call in the JUSTICE LEAGUE... better round up Superman, Impulse, Green Arrow, Cyborg, and Aquaman... (Smallville)

http://images.wikia.com/smallville/images/c/c1/Svjusticeleague.jpg (http://images.wikia.com/smallville/images/c/c1/Svjusticeleague.jpg)

[uraydo]

"Talk about the wrong stuff...":D

Fun knee!

[Mobe1969]

Maybe a moderator was just making a point that THE WAR IS OVER...:D

[cutie_tech123]

happy birthday! wish you all the best in your career. good luck in your everyday journey. God bless and more power!
________________

cutie_tech123
Technology supplier search engine Conjungo has been launched to help ease search times for companies looking for suppliers of technologies. Conjungo is the only place online where technology vendors can list their entire channel in an easily searchable format. This helps buyers find local or specialist resellers. http://www.conjungo.com

[ScarCrow28]

happy birthday! wish you all the best in your career. good luck in your everyday journey. God bless and more power!
________________

cutie_tech123
Technology supplier search engine Conjungo has been launched to help ease search times for companies looking for suppliers of technologies. Conjungo is the only place online where technology vendors can list their entire channel in an easily searchable format. This helps buyers find local or specialist resellers. http://www.conjungo.com


Its too bad Cutie_Tech123 is a bot profile. I was really diggin the avatar.